What’s the singsong experience?

It’s when a Gatekeeper starts offering information, in a continuous pattern, to your request.

Don’t misunderstand — I had spent several hours sourcing into a particular entertainment company with very little — almost none — success.

Several hours.

Admittedly, the customer said it was a challenge.

Then I got “lucky.”

It was 7 my time and 4 on the West Coast where my target was located.

I was frustrated.

I was slightly angry.

That’s how I get when I get frustrated.

Infantile — I know — you don’t have to tell me but sometimes it serves me. Other time I just try to stay away from other people, but last night what felt like an unproductive day motivated me.

I hate to go to bed feeling like a loser.

I kept dialing.

Finally, on one call I was transferred from the Gatekeeper’s console to an executive assistant (to one of the Executive VPs who reported to the CEO).

She answered!

Most at this company had not been answering throughout the day. I had been doing a lot of “stabbing in”* with few results.

I had been given a list of names inside the company and the request was to fill in the reporting structures under those names.

I needed the reports of the EVP she reported to. I had one of them from the customer. My gut was telling me there were several more.

‘Hi Judy — whatcha’ need?” she asked, all friendly-like.

I’m sorry, Marla, this is Maureen–”

(Before the receptionist/gatekeeper transferred me I asked her (quickly) whom she was transferring me to. She gave me the EA’s name (Marla) so that’s why I knew it. Marla didn’t say her name when she answered.)

She cut in before I could finish. Actually, I was finished. I say as little as possible when I’m calling.

“Oh, you’re coming in from the reception desk — no matter!” she chirped. “Whatcha’ need?”

Now, don’t ask me why she said “no matter” and then don’t ask me why she asked me what I needed. She just did. It happens, sooner or later. You just have to get to the later sometimes.

I told her what I needed:

“I was trying to reach Peter Boyle’s group — I understand you support him?”

“Yes,” she answered, pleasantly.

“I understand Matt Hogue’s title has changed (the receptionist/gatekeeper had given me that much).”

“Yes, he’s the CFO now. He was the VP,” she confirmed, still pleasant.

I could feel myself tensing. When you’re phone sourcing you reach a do-or-die moment when you can sense if the person on the other end is going to proceed (or not). I was at that moment and my neck and shoulder muscles were hurting from the day’s frustrations. I sensed she would go on.

“But I don’t have the other members of the group. Can you tell me who they are?” I dice-rolled.

Like I said, this do-or-die moment is fraught with emotion for many phone sourcers — the phone sourcers reading this know what I mean. Phone sourcing is a high-stress activity, admittedly. It’s a big part of why many people don’t like doing it.

She trilled off seven names.

I was tired so I misspelled a couple, tripping on the keys as she was trilling but I got them down best I could without interrupting her roll.

I knew once I had the names I could cipher out the titles somehow.

Maybe even with her.

The names are the most important thing.

I gambled further, knowing from experience if she told me this much she’d go further with me:

“And can you tell me, Marla, what Jerome’s title is?”

“Accounting Manager,” she shot back.

“I think I misspelled Ann’s last name. What is it?” I asked, all the while horrified at the indecipherable mess I had made of it.

“Schuster?” she asked. I recognized the incongruent letters I had typed and also recognized how the mess I was staring at could be Schuster.

“Yes; with a ‘c’ or no ‘c’?” I vollied.

“With a ‘c’: S-C-H-U-S-T-E-R,” she slowly spelled.

I said nothing, listening to the silence when she finished.

I felt she wasn’t (finished).

“And she spells her first name with an e,” she added, breaking the silence.

“Thanks. I had it without,” I told her, matter-of-factly.

I was fighting to control my voice.

“And Lisa? What’s Lisa’s title?” I went on, holding my breath.

“Reservations VP,” she said.

Here comes the singsong part — it’s always music to my ears.

“And Jan is Marketing Director, John is Director, Business Operations, Pam is Regional Director of Sales and Ken — Sr Director Product Development,” she sang trippingly off her tongue, getting the job done.

“And you have Matt — CFO,” she finished.

It’s almost like they go into some sort of trance.

“Yes, I do have him,” I admitted, with an emphasis on “him.”

That’s it?” I asked, doing a final check while still typing what she had just told me, the last part from memory. I’m lucky in that voice/sound seems to “implant” itself into my memory (I keep hearing like what it was said) for a few seconds after I hear something.

“That’s it,” she answered, convincingly.

Quickly, I then said, “Marla, you’ve been a great help — I do appreciate it. Thank you and Good-bye!”

She said “Good-bye” and I hung up.

I breathed a long sigh and sat back, arching and stretching my arms around my keyboard and adjusting my head on my shoulders. I heard cracking and felt relief.

Now, you’re wondering why she told me all that she did and why, finally, it got easy? I don’t know for sure but I have my suspicions. I’d like to hear yours first, though. Tell me what you think.

*stabbing in When you call in to a company’s internal dial system; willy-nilly with the expectation that someone will answer at their desk who will be able to give you information. It’s (usually) a very effective phone sourcing technique!

“I need to find Application Engineers installing medical equipment — x-ray equipment to be exact — and I looked on LinkedIn and there’s not much I can use. Oh, sure, there are some application engineers who list ‘medical equipment’ in their profiles, but I need people from specific companies — companies like GE, Johnson & Johnson, 3M, Medtronics, Becton-Dickinson, Boston Scientific, Stryker, St. Jude, Varian, Cordis — you know, the majors. And I don’t need them if they worked at those companies in the past — I need them working at those companies today!

“I also don’t need all the desperate substitute offerings LinkedIn is giving me because they don’t have exactly what I need –I can’t wade through that mess of misfits.”

“Can you help me?”

“Yes,” I said.

“Can you help me fast?” he asked.

“Yes,” I said again.

“I have to warn you, though, a couple of those companies you listed are customers of mine so I won’t be able to source them but I think we’ll be able to add some other companies that will yield you a list of 30 or 40 that might do the trick for you,” I added.

“And you’ll be able to get me names of the application engineers at those companies who are installing medical equipment today?” he asked. There was an emphasis on the word “today.”

“Yes,” I answered.

“And you’re sure they will be application engineers — the guys in the field installing the equipment?” he pressed, still unsure I knew what he was talking about.

“I promise,” I solemnly swore.

“How long will it take?”

“Give me 48 hours,” I answered. I’ll be able to send you probably half of what’s out there to get you started. Give me another 48 hours and I’ll send you the rest.”

I heard the surprise in the silence that followed.

“You there?” I asked.

“Yes, yes, I’m here,” he stammered. You sure you’ll be able to find these guys? I’ve wasted two weeks foolin’ around with the crap online. I can’t waste any more time.”

I understood I had a doubting Thomas on my hands long before he asked me this last question. I also understand the hurt, confusion, and doubt that his own failed efforts on this difficult search were casting upon mine. It wasn’t his fault — he’s been led to believe the remedy for hard-to-fill positions like his resided online.

It doesn’t.

The information* he seeks resides in the tightly cocooned interiors of companies like the world-class players he mentioned and it’s hard to get to. It takes a refined sense of fast timing and intuition to reach it.

Fast timing and intuition doesn’t exist online.

They just don’t.

They exist in the sharply honed telephone skills of clinicians like me and other expert phone sourcers who paw and peek and dig and dive into these companies. It exists in your own or another’s ability to engage strangers to tell you things.

Anyone can “engage” the Internet.

It never says “No.”

It never barks back at you or asks you why you need the information you’re seeking.

The Internet is safe.

It’s anonymous and it’s modern technology so it feels like something’s getting done.

The results (in the example given above) speak for themselves.

“I’m sure,” I assured him. “If I don’t, you don’t pay me!” I added, closing the deal.

“Give me 48 hours,” I said.

“What do you need to get started?” he asked.

*Before anyone gets too excited let me state that there are some positions that are fillable with information found online. But the high paying, challenging ones? Not so much.

One of ERE’s long-time members, Ted Moore, in a comment to that article, stated, “If you rely heavily on LinkedIn and similar tools to connect with those your clients can easily find and recruit on their own, at least as they perceive it (and what else matters?), I look forward to competing with you.”

I know Ted and I also know he means what he says.

I also know as time marches on those who think LinkedIn is sourcing are eventually going to pay a heavy price for their growing addictions.

In my “Help Me Help You” document that I send to all my new customers requesting telephone names sourcing, there is a paragraph that instructs the customer to provide me:

– Any names you might already have — this does two things: 1) avoids me duplicating your efforts and 2) gets me in to the targets faster. Be sure to include their titles and any contact info you have on them — their titles help me understand how close I am to the target and what these folks may be called at the respective companies and their contact info gives me clues as to how to get inside their organizations.

More and more we have the LinkedIn discussion.

THEM: Do you use LinkedIn?

ME: Not much.

THEM: We’ve already done LinkedIn.

ME: Silence.

THEM: We can’t find anything that works.

ME: Silence.

THEM: That’s why we’re calling you.

Me: Silence.

THEM: I’ve read your articles. Do you really think the majority of candidates are not on LinkedIn?

ME: Absolutely.

THEM: I think I believe you. I’ll be frank; I didn’t believe it at first.

ME: Silence.

THEM: You once wrote maybe 3% were findable online (see comments here). Do you still think that percentage is accurate?

ME: Absolutely.

THEM: That’s hard to believe with 135 million members!

ME: Silence.

THEM: I recently looked at the numbers — that’s how I came across one of your articles.

ME: Silence.

THEM: About 35% of the site’s members are American. We do all of our recruiting here in the States.

ME: Silence.

THEM: I’ve recently seen numbers that estimate only about 10-15% of LinkedIn profiles are in the active range.

ME: Do the math.

THEM: That would mean only about 4 to 7 million Americans have profiles that mean much of anything on LinkedIn.

ME: There are about 150 million workers in America. I’ve seen the number pegged closer to 200 million recently.

THEM: What do you need to get started?

What I haven’t included here is the question some ask: “What if the names you send me are on LinkedIn?”

ME: Depending on the space we’re working, a small percentage may be. If it’s recruiters you want, chances are most of them will be and you don’t need me. Have at it. But if it’s Uranium Geologists you want, I guarantee the companies you desire won’t have many of their GeoScientists listed. But let’s do this. You do LinkedIn first. Please do it first. Send me the names of people you find. I won’t send you them. How’s that for fair?

THEM: I don’t have time.

ME: Silence.

THEM: So I suppose if they do turn up on LinkedIn that’ll be up to us to swallow.

ME: Silence.

THEM: That’s fair. What do you need to get started?

“Insurance doesn’t cover this. I need a second job,” she said, matter-of factly and in the common-sense tone I have always known her to adopt.

We went on to talk about several other things — how the “guys” in her male-dominated industry don’t appreciate or are willing to pay her fairly for the tremendous extra volume of business she has drummed up for the sales team in the past three years she has been with the company she works for now.

Granted, that’s her side of things and there may be another.

However, at the end of our conversation she happened to mention that she had developed a business relationship with someone who hates the telephone.

“How does that work for him?’ I asked, laughing.

“It works fine because I do the phone for him. He comes here five hours a week and he sits next to me while I call his list of prospects and pitch his product.”

“When I get someone interested I say, ‘Let me see if Jack is available and I’ll patch him through.’”

“It works beautifully.”

“I bet,” I said. “What does he pay you to do that?”

“He pays me $50 for the five hours plus $1,000 for any sale he makes. “

I replied, “You mean to tell me he comes into your home, sits next to you on the telephone and listens (and learns) while you do business development for him?”

“He hates the phone,” she answered in reply.

I started to tell her that was way not enough money but then I stopped.

My brother told me an article he’d read that said Americans are willing to work for 25 cents an hour, so who am I to judge?

It works for her and it works for him so I left well enough alone.

“There’s your second job,” I volunteered instead.

“What do you mean?” she asked.

“Most people hate the phone. If you’re willing to not only do that for them but also demonstrate your skill while you’re doing it so they can learn from you — there are plenty of people who’d hire you to do that!” I almost shouted.

If you’d like her to do that for you, too — and learn from her while she does it — contact me and I’ll put you in touch with her.

She lives here in Cincinnati so you’d have to be close (if you want to learn from her at her knee) or be willing to come here.

OR you may see the value (like I do) and be happy for her to do your biz dev for you from afar.

I guarantee you’ll be pleased with her (your) results.

For more podcasts, webinars, and articles on recruiting be sure to check out The Fordyce Letter!

One of the ideas behind technology is that it empowers us to work creatively. By blending different technologies we can democratize communication in new and surprising ways.

If you buy into the theory (and I do) that future generations will design and build their own technologies by blending what works and what doesn’t work in different situations, then you’re far on your way to understanding that what works for one person might never work for another.

Once again, I’m going to approach this subject from a phone sourcer’s perspective and demonstrate how I blend the use of high technology with low technology.

Remember early on in this series when I delineated old (low) technology from new (high) technology in how we communicate?

BRAVE NEW WORLD (High technology)

Text

Instant messaging

Electronic mail

Social media exchange

Cellphone (mobile)

Real-time video (telepresence)

OLD WORLD (Low technology)

Snail mail

Fax

Land line telephone

Face-to-face communication

Keith Halperin pointed out in the comments section of that first part in this series that I forgot real-time video (broadband/telepresence, Skype, etc.) so I added it above.

There are many in our community who insist that the use of technology (Internet search, e-mail, mobile applications, messaging, etc.) is all one (really) needs to perform the work that must be done in our industry.

In fact, Dr. John Sullivan recently wrote an article here on ERE that detailed how to recognize if you yourself have become a technology dinosaur and recommended doing what Jack Welch (past CEO, GE) did: acquire a technology mentor to upgrade your technology status in the event you are found guilty of more than five transgressions on Dr. Sullivan’s list.

I don’t agree with some of his postulations but then, none of us have to agree. As the many comments brought forth, different things work differently for different people.

And that’s my point.

Use what works for you.

Here’s what works for me on a typical sourcing job and here’s how it happens:

Work comes in through either a phone call (low tech) or an e-mail (high tech). The e-mails that come in are usually from established customers, all of whom were preceded originally by a telephone conversation (low tech).

Occasionally a job order gets faxed in (very low tech).

It warrants mentioning at this point that what once was high tech is now low tech; at one point faxes were very high tech, remember?

I look at the job in e-mail. Many times there are attachments to the order (job description, Excel lists of targets and/or names the customer already has, special instructions, etc.) and I format all that into a working document (using my handy dandy electronic Word skills — still very high tech).

Next I do the lowest tech thing of them all. I think!

I plan, I plot, and I posture the job into how I am going to approach it.

When I first started sourcing — and you’ve heard me confess this before — I would spend inordinate time on the Internet searching for information … scratch that … searching for names — that I could use on a job.

Remember, this was the mid to late 1990s, so Internet search was new and cutting edge (very high tech) and very few people knew how to do it. The results that came in could pretty much be used as long as they had been “checked.”

We all know what that means.

As long as the person was “still there” (meaning still at a company) they were pretty much good to go on the list that got submitted to a customer.

It was so much fun to be a whiz-bang Internet sourcer.

Today, not so much.

That same once-high-tech formula has now become a low-tech approach that is being misused in some sourcing circles and is the main determinant why sourcing fails in many organizations.

In sourcing far more sophistication is required today than way back then.

Remember when we started this final piece in this series, I said, “future generations will design and build their own technologies by blending what works and what doesn’t work in different situations“?

Those in the know in sourcing today have done just that.

Until interactive applications become practical (and this will take years), matching robust common-sense knowledge with computers enables a new class of sourcers to make sense of today’s world with a breadth of knowledge that can be integrated with (some) computer applications.

They’ve recognized that technology morphs over time and what’s new today was old back then and what’s old now was new before.

When Lou Adler said that we must kick the sourcing habit in a recent article here on ERE, he said sourcing is getting easier by the day.

He’s right.

I personally don’t agree with him when he says, “at the current rate, by March 11, 2012, everyone will be connected by one degree of separation with everyone else either via LinkedIn or Facebook.”

I think that ignores the trepidation that is beginning to develop in the population around over-exposure, but that tale remains to be told.

Sourcing (as most people think of it) is on the endangered list because its high tech approach is yielding inadequate and many times stale results.

So how can we make the old new again and the new old again?

We can learn how to communicate with each other, and yes, you can just about guess in what direction we’re going here.

What works for me in the next step in my sourcing process is another low-tech tool.

I get on the phone.

I said before that when I started sourcing (in the mid 1990s) I’d spend lots and lots of time on the Internet forestalling that fateful moment when I had to pick up the phone.

This has become a common low-tech problem that self-medicates itself with the overuse (and misuse) of the Internet.

Nowadays, on most jobs, it’s just way faster (for me) to pick up the phone and start talking to people to obtain the information I need.

It doesn’t much matter anymore how scary the job looks.

I just start calling my target lists, knowing that the more I call, the easier the job is going to become.

The more I talk to people, the more I learn.

I call because I know the majority of the people I need for my job I cannot find on the Internet.

No way.

No how.

This calling — what may seem to you a low-tech technique — may not work so well for you. I’m going to ask you why that is.

You can send e-mails (most of which won’t get read and those that do stand a very high chance of being misunderstood) and you can send text SOS messages out to your network of contacts or you could post your need in some social networking group you’re a member of.

You could even make a video of yourself detailing your urgent need for a medical device sales application engineer and tell them where to send their resume.

You can use all those high-tech channels and then you can sit and wait for results.

Unless you’re some mega-bucked organization that was way ahead of the curve and has been investing in today’s high tech so-called communication channels for the last 10 years, using all the high-tech gadgets of today isn’t going to mean squat if you can’t talk with somebody and make a connection.

I think communication that uses real-time analogy and association is the highest technology we as humans possess.

It’s a brave new world and, oddly enough, it very much resembles the old.

Part IV. Part III. Part II. Part I. Intro.

In truth there’s not a lot of difference in the two.

In both, you want to engage people naturally. Talking with a business associate should be not much different from talking with a friend.

Talking with a friend employs many of the same techniques we use in business communications — respectful and tactful interaction.

There are some areas of intimacy that should not be transgressed. Revealing too much of your personal business in a business transaction is generally thought to be not good advice. Use common sense here.

We’ve all heard the so-called “7%-38%-55% rule”: that communication is comprised of 55% body language, 38% tone of voice, and 7% content of words.

That’s mostly true except when…

• your words, body language, and tone contradict each other
• you’re on the telephone
• you’re speaking to someone who doesn’t speak your own language

If your words, body language, and tone disagree, body language and tone will tell your story.

If you’re on the phone and there is no way to “see” your body language, your tone and word choice are going to be critical. I tell my phone sourcing students that attitude and stance are what they need most of when calling for information.

Cross-cultural communication is an area that is gaining study as our borders haze into one another. Language training is becoming commonplace these days in businesses that seek to do business globally. Grasping what we as humans have in common and how that commonality can unite us seems to form the basis for this type of communication.

Intercultural and international understanding is an area in which I hope someone more knowledgeable than me will write an article on here on ERE.

Because I am a phone sourcer I’m going to concentrate today on what communication techniques work best for me in my phone sourcing activities.

Your mileage may differ (but I don’t think by much).

In both personal and business communications, the most important thing is to keep your tone and pitch at “normal” levels.

Because you’re working (mostly) without visual “body language” — the largest component in most communications — your tone and pitch on the telephone are hypercritical.

If you speak too fast you’ll sound nervous.

Too slow — bored (and boring). Your listener may tune you out.

Too high — that nervous thing again.

Too low — your confidence could appear limited.

Strive to keep your tone and pitch at normal levels.

It’s not hard if you relax and lose the fear of calling that many in business have today.

This means to speak at a moderate pace and in a normal tone of voice.

You must take both your surroundings and the surrounding of the person you’re calling into account.

If you’re calling into a company, chances are the first person you’re going to meet up with is the Gatekeeper.

These ladies eat milquetoast with coffee all day long.

If your aim is to talk to someone who can give your company business, there’s no excuse (nor has there ever been one) not to do a little research on the front end on who you might want to talk to.

Sure, situations arise where there is nothing to be found (online) about a particular company, but the example that follows will work in most situations:

“Hello, Amanda. This is Maureen Sharib. Can you please transfer me to Finance?”

(About half the time they will transfer you to someone in Finance – if you’ve sounded confident and knowledgeable. At this point it’s your job to jump in and ask who you’re being transferred to — but sometimes you need more …)

“Who do you want to talk to in Finance?”

“I see that Sheila Watkins is your CFO — is Sheila available?”

“Ms. Watkin’s calls are taken by Delilah Atkins — would you like to talk with her?”

“Absolutely, Amanda. That would be great. Can you tell me, before you transfer me, what Ms. Atkins extension is?”

“Sure, it’s 468; hold one minute!”

I immediately gained a small level of familiarity with the Gatekeeper when I repeated her name back at her (because she told me her name; if she does not tell you her name, skip this part.)

I told her who I was; I removed the mystery so she didn’t have to ask/wonder.

I told her immediately how she could help me.

I had information on backup (the CFO’s name) in case I needed it. This is one of my “tricks.” I spool out a little information at a time. I offer it in bits and pieces only on an “as needed” basis. By using this technique you’ll get an immediate “feel” for how security conscious the company is.

I mirrored her company culture. When I heard her refer to Sheila Watkins as Ms. Watkins I moved to the use of the more formal title in my approach.

I pressed her for a little more information. This is usually possible (unless she sounds impossibly harried) and gives me the beginning of an understanding of the company’s phone tree in the instance where I’m rewarded with an extension or a direct dial.

This is where body language in communication comes into play (over the phone).

By visualizing what’s going on at the other end of the phone many times you can “imagine” the body language of the other party.

You can hear what’s going on in a Gatekeeper’s background if you’re “listening” for it.

You can “imagine” her physical reaction to stress.

You can “hear” stress in a person’s voice and you can act on those cues.

In the example above I was crisp and to the point.

My words were said in a moderate and confident tone of voice.

My voice was naturally animated when it needed to be and my words were enunciated.

My voice was calm and relaxed.

In every instance, I sound sincere.

She didn’t have to struggle to hear/keep up with/understand what I was asking for.

I told her the truth every step along the way so she (usually) immediately “trusts” me.

Hearing a ringing telephone in the background I could “visualize” some of what was going on in her environment and a little of her “body language” — at least enough to gain a modicum of cooperation from her.

I know this may seem farfetched to some of you, but other phones sourcers, I’m sure, will back me up here.

Here’s another one of my tricks and this is where the “attitude” in phone sourcing comes in.

I expect nothing.

There are many times I get rebuffed.

I take that as part of the potion.

By not being expectant I don’t get freaked out when I do get rebuffed.

That freak-out doesn’t carry over into my next calls.

I just move on to the next call with no frenzy.

I take nothing personally.

I have a “next” mentality.

On an “appearance” note, the words you use will create an impression of you even though it’s only the telephone.

Your vocabulary must be correct: we’re often judged by the words we use and the kind of grammar we speak.

Don’t ever use words you don’t know the meaning of. You’ll come across as strange and out of context.

Likewise, use small words that are easy to pronounce.

Nobody ever complains because you made something easy to understand.

(I saw that statement on Twitter recently.)

Pronunciation is something we could all practice, daily.

In business (and in our personal communications) we have to connect with people from all walks of life.

Communication is the lifeblood of your existence.

Make it easy for others to understand you.

If you do this, you’ll suddenly start understanding more yourself.

Next week we’ll talk about how to use both low and high technology appropriately in our communications. Again, it’s going to be from a phone sourcer’s perspective.  I hope you’ll join the discussion from your perspective!

Part III. Part II. Part I. Intro.

“That’s the problem, isn’t it?” I answered, while thinking to myself that none of us ever really do.

She nodded unhappily.

“Did you read One Lesson Lois?” I asked.

She nodded that she had.

“Did any of that resonate with you?” I asked again.

“Well, sort of,” she said.

“But Lois was never in the recruiting business so I can kind of understand her reluctance. I know it’s my job to call people …” she trailed off.

I watched her body language as she said this.

The right hand that she had drawn back clenched to her chest moved to her leg and she started to scratch at her knee. Her left hand went to her mouth and started pushing at her lower lip.

She appeared to be thinking.

I was aware that on the first day of training Marianne’s co-workers joked that they never heard her on the phone. The joke included the explanation that her speech on the phone was so low that the others in adjoining cubicles couldn’t hear her — like a “mouse in church,” as her manager referred to her.

“It’s just that I don’t know what to say when they ask me why I’m calling!” she blurted.

“Now that you know you can eliminate much of that with your approach does that make any difference?” I asked.

“I suppose,” she admitted, reluctantly. “I guess old habits die hard,” she admitted, and laughed.

“But they do die, Marianne, if you replace them with other habits. That takes practice,” I said, feeling like Mother Hen.

As I said that I reached for the phone and nodded to her to put her headset on.

I called the first number we had on the TDW list and a bright young thing answered.

She didn’t tell me her name so I skipped right in, asking simply, “This is Maureen Sharib. Can you tell me, do you all offer pigging services from your office?”

“We don’t here, Maureen, but we do in our other TX office. You want the number?” she answered, helpfully.

“Absolutely, I do. That would be a great help.”

She gave me the number.

“Can you also tell me who I should ask for in that office?’

I could feel the tension tightening next to me.

“Sure! Ask for Paul Miller* — he heads our pigging services group.”

What’s his title?” I asked.

“Pigging Services Director,” she answered.

I scribbled Paul’s name down before asking, “In case I can’t reach him — is there anyone else in the pigging group I might try?”

“Let me look in that office,” she answered.

It’s long been one of my stock-in-trade tricks to call one office to gather information about another.

When I don’t have any names in to a particular target (and this is the case far more than you’d suspect) this can be a very effective technique.

When she said, “Let me look in that office,” she revealed to me she had access to the company corporate directory that probably included worldwide information.

Think of the power in that!

“There are several people listed under him,” she said. Without me having to ask, she went on. “There’s Michelle Michaels, Peter Lynn, Mark Lunowski, Jerome Matheson, Trey Walters, Renee Barr, Tommy Wu and Bob Rivers. You need them all?” she added.

Little did she know I already have them — having scribbled them as fast as she said them.

I took a chance.

“What I really need to know is are any of them listed as engineers?”

I held my breath.

Silence.

“Well, yeah, three of them are.”

This time I waited, silently.

“Peter Lynn, Jerome Matheson, and Tommy Wu. They’re called ‘sales engineer.’”

Bingo.

“Is one of them the manager?” I pushed.

“No, it looks like Trey Walters is the manager. Sales Engineering Manager,” she enumerated, sounding like she was enjoying this exchange.

Perfect.

“And the others?” I prompted, wanting to better understand how they might be structuring their groups inside these companies.

“The others look like Sales Reps and Account Reps,” she answered.

“Who’s what?” I asked.

“Michelle Michaels is the admin, Mark Lunowski is sales; Renee Barr and Rivers are Account Reps.”

“That’ll do it!” I exclaimed before asking just one more question, “Do any of them have direct dials or extensions?”

Not only did they have direct dials, they also had cell numbers and she gave all of them to me.

After I’d hung up Marianne sat quietly, shaking her head.

“I can’t believe she gave all that to you!” she then exclaimed.

“That the issue here, Marianne –you must believe,” I said. “If you don’t believe you’re going to sound worried and full of self-doubt and she’s going to hear it. You get that, right?”

“But she didn’t ask you why you needed all that information!” Marianne cried.

“They rarely do,” I answered.

“Her job is to help. That’s what she just did.”

She nodded that she understood but I could see she still had her doubts.

Like Bob did, about Lois (see One Lesson Lois).

I’m going to end this series here letting you know that Marianne did have some success on the phone while I sat with her and that one of the techniques we used was calling into plants and talking to a couple Plant Managers who had used pigging services that had been mentioned in testimonials on a few of the sites.

If you had visited the link in Part VIII when I first introduced Marianne’s challenge you would have seen the Wikipedia explanation that, “Pigging has been used for many years to clean larger diameter pipelines in the oil industry. Today, however, the use of smaller diameter pigging systems is now increasing in many continuous and batch process plants as plant operators search for increased efficiencies and reduced costs…Pigging systems are already installed in industries handling products as diverse as lubricating oils, paints, chemicals, toiletries, cosmetics and foodstuffs.”

The Plant Managers we were able to reach were very helpful in giving us names of people who had worked on their installations and additional companies in the industry.

Marianne was let go about a month after our training exercise.

I do not know where she is today.

*All the names listed at TDW are fictional and TDW’s results are actually the results of another company in the industry. For privacy purposes I am not comfortable putting results of any particular company on the Internet. TDW’s results were different.

This is an ongoing series regarding phone sourcing. Here’s part I, part II, part III, part IV, part V, part VI, part VII, part VIII, and part IX.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip/it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE. 
I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!

Phone sourcing is simple but it’s not easy.

There’s a ton of tension in the process for most people.

Excellent phone sourcers know how to use that tension to energize them selves and direct the flow of information.

There’s every bit as much science to this as art.

The science comes in the understanding of human nature (including our own) and the art flows out of that.

Once again I hope you enjoyed this series.

I enjoyed writing it.

Maureen Sharib, 2011

One of our readers, Ben Ness, SOSed Marianne (in Part VIII, Comments section) with the following:

I googled “pigging,” figured out it was the same as “pipeline inspection,” did a keyword search on linkedin using “pipeline inspection” and came up with 280 results who currently still work in this industry. And that is just in my network. The Internet is a beautiful thing. Marianne, if you arereading this, I hope this helps.

I asked Ben what kind of LinkedIn account he had, because when I put the words “pipeline inspection” into LinkedIn’s keyword box I got 280 results too, but guess what?

NONE of them had any names attached to them — only titles like:

Pipeline Inspection Manager at Weatherford International Inc.
Houston, Texas Area | Oil & Energy

Production Manager, Asset Manager at GE Oil & Gas PII

Systems Analyst & Inventory Control Manager at Pipeline Inspection Company
Houston, Texas Area | Oil & Energy

Pipeline inspection at Universal Pegasus International
Corpus Christi, Texas Area | Oil & Energy

Pipeline Inspection Manager at Mustang Engineering
United States | Oil & Energy

Vice President USA, Canada, Caribbean at TD Williamson Inc
Tulsa, Oklahoma Area | Oil & Energy

Pipeline Inspection Manager at Weatherford P&SS
Houston, Texas Area | Oil & Energy

supervisor, pipeline inspection at Superior Well Services, Inc.
Tuscaloosa, Alabama Area | Oil & Energy

Pipeline Inspection at Edward Newman Consulting LLC
Greater Denver Area | Oil & Energy

Pipeline Inspection Tech at Weatherford
Houston, Texas Area | Oil & Energy

Pipeline Inspection Tech at Weatherford
Phoenix, Arizona Area | Infor

It turns out Ben pays $89 per month for the “Executive” level account and feels it is “well worth it.”

That very well may be but it doesn’t much matter in this instance because not only would we run down a whole lot of rabbit holes chasing Ben’s pipeline inspection dreams, we’d also miss the mark because pigging operations include but are not limited to cleaning and inspecting of the pipeline.

This is the kind of thing where so many searches jump the tracks and go terribly, terribly wrong.

What we “think” the client should take is not always what they will take.

We have to be terribly, terribly careful with this.

The targets Marianne had on the screen, she had been told, would be good places to find the types of people we needed.

Using them as a starting point, we went to Hoover’s and built a list.

Here is the information on the companies Hoover’s had data on that had the word  “pigging” in their descriptions.

It turned out that one of them was her client.

A good place to start on a search is to look at who the competitors are of your client.

The list included:

SPX Corporation
Charlotte NC  4,886.80M 15,500         Industrial machinery, nec
704-752-4400

T. D. Williamson, Inc.
Tulsa OK     456.69M     1,425   Oil and gas field machinery
918-447-5100

Process Pigging Systems, LLC
Cincinnati OH Single Location        2.00M         4       Process control instruments
+1-513-731-6005

Star Trak Pigging Technologies Inc Katy TX     Single Location        1.00M         9      Pipeline construction,
+1-281-599-7557

Pigging Solutions, LLC
Willard MO Single Location        0.31M         2       Hardware

+1-417-685-4018

Pinnacle Pigging Systems Inc
Pasadena TX   Single Location        0.10M         1       Oil and gas field services, nec
+1-713-920-2196

Aquilex HydroChem
Deer Park TX United States                    Sanitary services, nec
713-393-5600

It was obvious there were a couple large companies in this industry; they were listed first. The numbers you see listed on the second lines of each company are the gross sales and then the number of employees.

Eyeballing the first company, we see that SPX:

…controls the flow of multiple industries. The company operates from four units: Flow Technology (pumps, valves, other fluid handling devices); Test and Measurement (diagnostic tools, fare-collection, cable/pipe locators); Thermal Equipment and Services (cooling, heating, ventilation); and Industrial Products and Services (compactors, power systems, broadcast antenna systems, aerospace components). SPX focuses on global infrastructure development; end markets include power, petrochemical exploration, refinement, and distribution, as well as food/beverage, and tools/diagnostics. It operates in 35-plus countries with a sales presence in 150 countries. More than 50% of sales are generated outside the U.S.

The second company, T. D. Williamson, states:

T.D. Williamson must have known that a financial touchdown was in the pipeline when he founded his namesake company in 1920. T. D. Williamson, Inc. designs, manufactures, and maintains oil field machinery and systems including pipeline pigging, gas leak detection, pipeline inspection, plugging, tapping, valve and clamp, and cathodic protection equipment. The company also offers general pipeline, training, and turnkey services. T. D.Williamson operates a global network of sales offices and representatives. It has strategically located international service centers and/or manufacturing plants worldwide, including in Belgium, India, Singapore, the UK, the U.S., and Venezuela.

The others appeared to be minor players, but I thought we’d probably stumble across some others as we went along.

That’s what usually happens.

Looking more closely at SPX and Googling the terms spx pigging together we discern that the company has a division involved with pigging: GD Engineering®, an SPX company, offers a technology that allows the deployment of multiple pig launchers on unmanned platforms.

That’s what we want: the guys who go out on the sales calls who know what is required in the set-up. We find their website. The contact button reveals their locations and phone numbers for locations around the country:

GD Engineering
19191 Hempstead Highway
Phone 281-807-2818
Fax 281-807-2805

It also appears to offer up other companies for different products used in pigging:

Apex Instruments (for closures)
Girard Industries (for pig signalers)
Energy Equipment

We copy and paste all of them, along with their numbers.

All of a sudden we’ve expanded our list of targets with information that the targets themselves have provided on the Internet!

We also do a run on LinkedIn for GD Engineering. Nothing of any help comes up.

We move on.

Turning to T. D. Williamson we first do a LinkedIn search because we have the window open.

Lookie there: 108 results. Don’t get excited. One first name and last initial on the first one — a Talent Development Coordinator, Dallas B.

Titles only on every result after that first one!

That’s it (for me — your results may differ).

We refine and put the word “sales engineer” into the title box.

Nothing.

We remove the word “engineer” and leave “sales” in the box.

A mess of 12 comes up (no names among any of the 12, only titles!) but the majority of them do not look like they’d be much help anyway. Titles like:

Sr. Sales Rep. for T.DWilliamson — MIGHT know who we’re after, but who is it? And in what vertical? Pigging? No way to tell!

Service Center Supervisor — This person might know but again, who is it?

Business Development Mgr, Alaska at TD Williamson — Uhh … probably not

Marketing Communications, Lead Generation, Social Media, Search Engine Optimization, E-Marketing, and Website Management — Absolutely not

Global Web Publisher at T.D. Williamson, Inc. — Ditto

Manager Pipeline Solutions at T.D. Williamson, Inc. — Might know but who is it?

Senior Sales Representative at T.D. Williamson, Inc. Maybe but again, who is it?

Sales/Service Coordinator at TDW — Maybe, but…

Sr. Sales Representative at T.D.Williamson, Inc. — Probably knows, but…

Contracts Manager — Probably wouldn’t know but could. But who is it?

Operations Manager — Might know but…

Senior Buyer — No.

LinkedIn is basically useless to me at this point and I quickly lose patience with the exercise.

I turn to Google and look for the website. I want to know if it, like its largest competitor, also has a division that handles pigging.

It does — it’s called TDW Offshore Solutions and they have offices all over the country with the majority centered, from the looks of it, in the Midwest.

But there’s more!

Under “Events” there’ something called “Pipeline Pigging Conference.”

Man! I can’t wait!

I click on it.

NACE Corrosion in Houston

IPEIA in Alberta, Canada

Southern Gas Conference in Charlotte, NC

And more, many more.

I copy them all out and paste them, knowing that many of them will be valuable sources of additional target companies when we need them.

And we will.

But one of the best parts of that link above is the revelation at the site of terminology used in pigging, all keywords we can use to further our search. Words like:

- Hot Tapping & Plugging Services
- Freeze Plugging Services
- Plugging Isolation Services
- Cutter Repair Services
- Equipment Repair Services
- Hydrostatic Testing Services
- Drying Service
- Pigging Products & Services
- Online Cleaning Services
- Pipeline Cleaning Services
- New Construction Services
- Gas Leak Detection Services
- Turnkey Management Services

But in the meantime my eye drifts back up to that list of offices listed throughout the United States.

I nod towards it and say to Marianne, “Let’s start calling those.”

She sits up expectantly and reaches for the phone.

Then she hesitated and shrank back into her seat, drawing her clenched hand in to her chest.

Next week we’re going to finish Marianne’s lesson and also, this series.

I sincerely hope you’ve enjoyed it.

P.S.  Yesterday when I was writing the IX article as I searched LinkedIn for the portions where I used LinkedIn, the only results I got were titles only.

Today the same searches are giving me (on the first couple pages) names, and then the info fades (as it does on unpaid accts) to first names and last initials and then to titles only.

Maybe it was a glitch in LinkedIn’s system yesterday but I can tell you this:

Several months ago I was one of the first who got results where the last name was represented only by an initial.

When I called it out in the sourcing circles I was told I must be imagining things.  Soon after everyone (who wasn’t paying) started getting them.

Sometimes I feel like a canary in a mine.

Are titles-only the near future of LinkedIn’s FREE search?

******

This is an ongoing series regarding phone sourcing. Here’s part I, part II, part III, part IV, part V, part VI, part VII, and part VIII.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip/it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE. I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!

Customers usually know who their own competitors are and understand that those are the best ponds to go fishing in.

If you’re doing work for a third party recruiter sometimes they do not know and, worse yet, are reluctant to ask their clients for fear of not looking like they know what they’re doing.

They don’t always work exclusively in an area to know that area intimately.

Your job as a sourcer sometimes is to augment their knowledge in a manner that doesn’t destroy their fragile egos.

This is easier said than done sometimes but it is critically important that the right targets be chosen before beginning any sourcing assignment.

Extreme care must be taken here and if it means spending extra time to correctly identify the field then it behooves you to do it.

It will save you much time and heartache later!

Her six coworkers all seemed to like her.

Her name was Marianne and she was a pretty 20-something and this was her second job after graduating from college.

She mostly didn’t say anything but she did answer willingly when called upon.

I sat down next to her at her desk on the second day of training.

She was scheduled after Max and she seemed organized and efficient when I sat down.

Her job was up on her screen and it was formatted exactly as I had asked the class to do it the day before.

She was quiet and attentive as she had been the day before.

I asked what we were looking for.

She answered that she wanted to work on a job that had been causing her quite a bit of stress.

She needed people involved in the pre-sales activity for a piece of pigging machinery that would be installed onto a food-manufacturing floor.

The client wanted them to live in the Midwest so they could travel around the country more easily than if they lived on one coast or the other.

Sound reasoning.

I asked her if she had found anyone.

She showed me a list of people who had obviously come from online; they had titles like sales managers, sales reps, and sales support with the occasional sales engineer sprinkled in.

It was the sales engineers we were after, I pointed out. It was right in the beginning of the job description.

“I know,” she admitted, disconsolately. “They’re just so hard to find!”

“What have you done so far?” I asked.

“Well, I looked on LinkedIn -- ,” she admitted before I stopped her in her tracks.

“You’re not going to find them on LinkedIn,” I stated, bluntly.

“How did you know?” she blinked, almost near tears.

“Because they’re not on LinkedIn, Marianne. If they ever were, chances are they’ve moved on and are not in the last reported place they listed.”

She continued to listen.

“Remember? LinkedIn rode the social media juggernaut and now — well, not so much.”

“Look — let’s do a LinkedIn search.”

She reached for her keyboard, and to my surprise LinkedIn flashed immediately up.

She was using it for her home page!

Ignoring that mistake, I told her to put the word “pigging” into the keyword box and the word “sales engineer” into the title box.

“Mark it current so we can see who has the title today,” I said.

“Now hit ‘search’,” I instructed.

Two results came up.

One — an “Andy V” — hadn’t worked in pigging since 1991, and the other, “Rick P.” listed himself as a designer for pigging products and as an application sales engineer but he had been with the same company for 19 years and was working in Alaska in the oil industry.

He had started his first job in 1975.

We all know what that means.

Come on, we do.

“I hate it that LinkedIn isn’t listing last names anymore,” Marianne remarked, seeming to ignore the paucity of resources being offered.

“Yeah, well, get used to it. There’s more of that to come,” I warned before telling her to change the title search’s “current” status to “current or past.”

Woo-hoo! Eight came up.

Just think.

Of 100 million “members” now on LinkedIn we can muster out only eight with “pigging” in their profiles.

Now, all of a sudden Rick’s last name came up — Rick Pruett — at the top of the heap.

But we all know what chance he stands.

Next came a John T. who worked for the same company but in Houston. He hadn’t worked in project sales since 2004 and now carried the title “Operations Manager.”

What are the chances he’d want to go back on the road 26 years after graduating from college with a B.S. in Engineering Technology?

Yeah, you guessed it.

Let’s not kid ourselves.

Next came Andy V. again and we all know what use he is to us at this point.

A smiling Chris P. showed up next and listed himself as a Consultant. It seemed he’d been working for himself the last 16 months.

Before that he was a “Global Sales Manager, Product Line Manager (Inspection)” and was also located in Houston.

Oh, but lookie there. He started school in 1971.

That ugly nemesis again — and, oh, he was in the oil business — not food.

It seemed nobody on the results page was in food.

Moving on, Richard Craig S. was a Corrosion Engineer in San Diego and we could see the connection topigging but it seemed he was also working with fuel lines.

“Not likely to be the same thing in the customer’s eyes and besides, who wants to move from San Diego to the Rust Belt?” I asked, deadpan.

She nodded her agreement.

Next up, Jason D. was now an Art Director, Multimedia Specialist, Art Guru in Florida, and what’s the point in even opening him up for inspection?

But let’s do it.

We’re on a wild goose chase anyway.

You tell me: do you see why he came up in the search?

I don’t.

Maybe this is why he came up in our search:

“From mingling with celebrities to guinea-pigging weird product or meditating deep in design, I always keep it interesting.”

Rock on Jason, but we’re going to move on.

Or not.

I just don’t have the strength it would take to investigate a “Territory Representative” at a company in Missoula, Montana that develops and markets cleaning, sanitizing, pest control, maintenance and repair products and services for the hospitality, institutional, and industrial industries who doesn’t even have the sense God gave a mule to fill out his profile let alone Peter R., a Business Development Manager at another oilfield services company.

We need someone experienced in the food industry.

There are no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

There are also no butts that I can see in any of the results so far that can put us remotely in the vicinity of what we need.

Marianne is discouraged but I’m not.

Next week we’re going to explore the opportunities LinkedIn did offer and we’re going to build on those few results using Hoover’s and a brief search engine visit to create a robust search that’s going to surprise you.

This week, though, you have a test to complete.

It’s not really so much a test as it is an opportunity for you to strut your stuff.

I want all of you online aficionados (and I know there are many of you!) to tell me what you’d do at this point.

I also want you few telephone sourcers out there to tell me how you’d proceed.

We all look forward to your advice.

This is an ongoing series regarding phone sourcing. Here’s part I, part II, part III, part IV, part V, part VI, and part VII.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip/it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE. I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!

Phone sourcing is all about attitude.

It’s not what you say but how you say it.

Great phone sourcers say very little.

They know how to elicit the information they seek with the questions they ask.

They think about a sourcing job like a puzzle.

They sketch out the outer rim and then flesh in the interior.

Phone sourcing jobs go faster the further you get into one; just as a puzzle helps to build itself more quickly the more you work it.

“I never learn anything talking. I only learn things when I ask questions.” — Lou Holtz

The class question from last week asked what things are at work that would cause Lisa our Gatekeeper to drop her defenses in the statement below.

“Lisa?  Hi, this is Maureen Sharib. Can you transfer me to Sheila McKinney?  Before you do, though, can you tell me: is Sheila one of the pipeline engineers there? She is? I thought so. In case I can’t reach Sheila, Michael Edwards is also one of the pipeline engineers I could try? That’s great, Lisa. And just in case I can’treach him, either, can you tell me who else in that group I could try?”

I will list them in occurrence, as I see them.

I said her name.

I then identified myself to her.

I asked for her help that included a name of someone inside the company; a name she was likely to recognize.

I asked one question at a time.

I repeated her name during the “interrogation.”

You may see something else. Tell us about it.

We left our student phone sourcer back in Part IV sitting nervously beside me, listening in on my calls.

After we’d managed to expand our call list with locations in the Marcellus Shale zone where we’d likely find the few pipeline engineers that existed in the region and had collected ten or so of them with my efforts I picked up the phone, handed it to him and said, “Your turn.”

He recoiled like I was about to hand him a hot poker, red-hot brand side first.

As he was collecting himself I put on the second head-set so I could listen in and pushed the “mute” button.

“Uhhh … Okay,” he said reluctantly, knowing this was part of the program and having been told in advance that I’d do some of the calls as a demonstration before handing it off to him to finish.

“What do you think would be best to call next?” he asked.

“Texas ought to be open by now — let’s call headquarters of that company and see if they have any offices in the Marcellus Shale region.”

Boldly he dialed the Texas headquarters number of the energy company that we had identified as one of the major players in the region.

He surprised me with his approach.

“Hello, Operator this is Max Hines in Ohio. I’m trying to reach Simon Michaelson in Pennsylvania.” I noticed a name he had tucked in to the job. It appeared to have come off LinkedIn.

“It looks like we have an office in Williamsport — but I don’t see him listed …” she trailed off, sounding like she was really trying to find Michaelson.

“You want the number?” she asked.

“Yes, ma’am I do,” Max answered.

She gave it to him.

Then he really surprised me.

“Do you have the ability to look into the Williamsport office?” he asked.

I sat back, knowing what was coming next.

She was either going to say “yes” or “no.”

If she said “yes” I knew the possibilities.

She said, “Yes.”

I wondered what he’d do with this opportunity.

“If Simon’s not there, is there anyone else listed I might connect with?” he asked.

I exhaled, waiting for the answer.

I was hopeful.

I wanted this to work for him.

“There are about thirty people listed there — what are you looking to do?” she queried.

Ignoring her question, he asked, “Is there another pipeline engineer listed?”

After a brief pause she said, “There looks like there are three of them listed. You want to try them?” she offered.

“Yes, Ma’am; that’d be a big help.”

Was I detecting a slight Texas drawl?

After she’d given them to him he went the extra mile and asked if any of them had direct dials.

Two did and one had a cell phone.

Hanging up the phone, I said to him, “I see my work’s done here.”

“I’m a clutch player,” he smiled.

“I see you are,” I said, rising from the chair and collecting my things.

“I’m going to go work with Marianne now. I want you to continue working on this and give me a report in a couple hours. I think you‘re going to do just fine,” I congratulated.

Marianne turned out to be a different story but we had her whipped into some performing shape when I left her desk to go on to the next victim.

It was a struggle though.

Marianne’s heart wasn’t in it.

That story in Part VIII.

This is an ongoingseries regarding phone sourcing. Here’s part I, part II, part III, part IV, part V and part VI.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip/it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE. I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!Some keyboards arenoisier than others.

If you’re phone sourcing the way I want you to phone source everything you’re hearing on the phone is going into your research document at the time you’re hearing it! That clickety-clack of the keyboard can stop some Gatekeepers from “sharing” with you. You don’t want that to happen.

I recommend you use a silent keyboard if yours is too noisy. Mine are rubbery and last about six months before the key symbols wear off. You can get one under $50. Here’s the one I have at present. It cost $17 plus shipping.An added benefit of this one is that it lights up.

I have a sense that a real yearning is emerging for information about how to communicate.

I mean about how to communicate face to face or over the phone and not about “communicating” on someone’s “Wall” on Facebook or sending an InMail through LinkedIn.

I’m talking about what you should say on the phone.

There’s a difference between calling an “active” candidate (one whose resume is out there or “in there” or a candidate who is obviously “out there,” meaning he is high-profile on the Internet or the trades) and the truly passive candidate: the guy we sourcers find closeted away behind a company’s closed doors, who is not listed anywhere on the Internet, who is way too busy working to even think about thinking about looking for another job.

When I’m calling through a list of folks, profiling, I don’t leave call back messages until I’ve called through the list 5-6 times.

When I’m sourcing, I’m in the habit of trying to remain in the power seat, in charge of the process.

When you leave a plaintive “please-call-me-back” message you’ve transferred “power” (and the chance of your success) into the hands of another person.

No, no, no, and double no, no, no. You never want to do that!

I call through a list, top to bottom, methodically, and talk to the ones that answer.

Let a number ring 2-3 times; usually they’ve answered if they’re there in that amount of time.

This can reduce calling time from 60-90 seconds per unanswered call to about 15 seconds, which includes the dial!

Definition of Profiling: The first contact with the candidate who has been identified through sourcing that includes an introduction to your opportunity and a gathering of facts about the potential candidate’s abilities.

That candidate may or (more probably) may not be thinking about another job.

Your task here is to knock on his door and introduce yourself and your mission and get his general information while taking his initial temperature regarding the opportunity you’re presenting.

This is quite different from contacting the “active” candidate who sent his resume in over the transom regarding a possible new job opportunity, which I talked briefly about above.

“How’d you get my name?” the phone-sourced potential candidate usually asks.

When I answer this, I tell them the truth.

I tell them I was tasked with identifying them within their organization to see if they might be interested in a specific opportunity.

If they press further I tell them they may have been located in a variety of ways, one of which (and usually the most probable) is that I called their organization to find out who they were!

This usually both surprises and delights them.

Other reasons I’ve given are that my attention fell upon them because of some posting they may have put out on the Internet regarding their work, or their name may have been passed to someone at the company I’m calling on behalf of because they were good at what they do.

If I found them on LinkedIn, I tell them so.

They’re never surprised by this one.

I’ve never told them I found them in a job board database because I’ve never been on a job board.

Whatever explanation I give them I punch the fact across that they have been specifically chosen for contact.

This is usually enough to assuage their paranoia (some industries are afflicted more so with this than others) and flatters them to the point where they relax and begin to share their information with me.

I try not to draw any lines in the sand. I feel this “first contact” is precarious enough without asking scary questions that they feel pressured to answer yes or no to.

I rarely ask them their salaries at this first contact. Few want to answer this.

After all, most of them are not looking for another job and don’t see the relevance in revealing this particular piece of information.

The object is to get them to start talking. Once they do this they will spill most of their beans along the way. Sometimes, even what they’re earning.

My job at this point is to listen and take notes.

The person on the other end of the phone isn’t going to give me squat if he doesn’t like me, and that’s the first and most important object of cold calling — the object being to like and enjoy what you’re doing because it’s going to come across in your voice and delivery.

Believe me, it will.

So every day is probably not a good idea to be doing this. You must “feel like it” so choose a time when you “feel like it” and go hard at it until you don’t!

Learn to manage your time. There are of things you have to do besides get on the horn, so set your days up to allow for this.

There are “good” times and “bad” times to call people. Remember that!

You’ll reach far fewer people from 11 to 1, and right after lunch some are sleepy and might not want to be bothered.

I like the 8 to 11 slot in the morning. I catch them at their desks before the day has taken its toll.

Or for the very same reason, that 4 to 6 timeslot can be effective.

Use common sense when you’re calling. Keep in mind the different time zones.

As the only direct contact I generally have with candidates is when I do profiling, I’m sure there are others who have better skill sets at eliciting information, but here’s what I say when I’m profiling:

Me: “Hi, this is Maureen Sharib. You’ve been identified by XYZ Corporation as someone they’re very interested in for an open position they have. Do you have a few minutes to share a little information with me?”

Them: “Huh? Who, me? How’d you get my name?”

Me: “Your name was identified by XYZ as someone they’re very interested in talking with regarding a design position they have open. Is now a good time to talk?”

Them: “Yeah, I guess so. But I’m not looking to make a move. Whatd’ya need?”

Me: “Well, let’s start with you. You’re an RF Design Engineer there?”

Them: “Yep. Level III.”

Me: “How long have you been with ABC?”

Them: “Three years, before this I was with LMN for two years and before that I was with DEF for seven.”

Me: “So you have 12 years experience — have you ever managed others?”

Them: “I don’t like to manage — I can’t stand people — ooops — did I say that?”

We laugh.

Me: “So you have 12 years experience?”

Them: “Yeah.”

Me: “You’re part of a design group now?”

Them: “Yeah, there are six of us. Jerry Speaks is our Manager. I gladly leave the management stuff to him.” (He’s stuck on the prior question, it seems. Management might be a sore spot for him.)

We laugh some more. (I’m making a written note who his manager is.)

Me: “Where did you go to school?”

Them: “Cal State Fullerton. I have a BS in Electrical Engineering and an MS in the same from there. I’m thinking about going for my PhD. Thinking about it.” (Emphasis on “thinking”.)

Me: “What do you like most about your job?”

Them: “Being left alone. They pretty much leave us alone to do what we want — probably because we’re working on some pretty high-level security stuff and they don’t understand much of it. My buddy Chad’s the Team Lead and I leave the facey-face stuff to him. I like working in the lab. What did you say your name was?”

Me: “Maureen Sharib. Would you be interested in learning more about this open position at XYZ?” I make another written note that “Chad” is his co-worker and the Team Lead. Chad who? You bet I’ll find out!

Then: “Well, yeah, I guess, it never hurts to listen.”

Me: “Would tonight be a good time for someone from XYZ to call you — maybe at home?”

Them: “Yeah, that would be good — tell them to call my cell, it’s 408 xxx xxxx.”

Me: “About 7:30 Pacific time then?”

Them: “That’s good.”

Me: “Before I say good-bye, I was wondering if you had any friends who might be interested in a test engineering position XYZ has open…”

Them: “Yeah! I do! My buddy Fred’s lookin’ to make a move — I’ll pass your name along to him.”

Me: “I wonder if I might email him the position?”

“Them: “Yeah, that’d be okay -– his email is fred.buddy@abc.com.”

Me: “Okay, thanks very much, I’ll get this right out to him and it’s been great talking to you, I wish you the best of luck — good bye!”   

So how do we find the other members in a person’s group when we know that group contains what we’re looking for?

As you recall, that was the last question posed to me by my student sourcer on the second day of our MagicMethod training.

For those of you just now tuning in, MagicMethod is my particular brand of phone sourcing. I’ve been phone sourcing since 1997 and the program developed (for me) as I struggled in the early part of my career to find a way to phone source that was something apart from the literature in existence at that time on the subject.

What am I talking about?  There was no literature in existence on phone sourcing when I started!

My early fears were only met with the chagrin I felt when my questions were met with surreptitious answers like…

“You find a local pizza joint and you call up and tell them you’re delivering individual pizzas to their department for a job well done (you guess) and who are all the ASIC engineers in the group so you can 1) take their individual orders and 2) know who gets what.”

“You learn how to hack and hack your way into the company’s intranet.”

“You tell them you’re from the state taxing authority and you need a list of all the employees in a particular department.”

All scary stuff.

Some of it dumb.

Some of it illegal.

All pretty effective when delivered w/ more nerve than it takes a burglar.

None, really, my cup of tea.

MagicMethod developed out of a desperate need to know.

It was a desperate need because the long and short of it was and is that I love(d) phone sourcing and I had to find a way I could do it that allowed me peace of mind.

MagicMethod fomented over several years and really started with a library of “scripts” that I wrote.

The “scripts” were really a diary I started to keep at the end of the day. When I had a particularly good day (or a particularly bad day) I found pleasure (or solace) in relating to myself the course of events in a written form.

The scripts worked to remind myself, over time, what worked and what didn’t.

As time went on I grew to realize it wasn’t so much what I said on my sourcing forays as how I said it.

The core premise of my training emerged from that theory.

That and the time-worn KISS principle to “Keep It Simple, Stupid.”

On a good percentage of calls a phone sourcer makes it is possible to say almost absolutely nothing and still get the information you seek.

The (few) veteran phone sourcers reading this understand what I mean and will agree with this.

Notice I’m not saying every call.

Nothing works 100% of the time.

When I say “a good percentage” I’m clearly talking (on most jobs) about 50% of the time.

There are fields — like pharma, biotech, defense, and some high tech — where this figure won’t hold, but in most verticals it will.

Fifty percent translates to mean that on about half of your calls, if you approach the Gatekeeper correctly, you’ll be rewarded with the information you seek.

It doesn’t necessarily happen right-out-of-the-gate but over time, and with practice, it will!

So here we are. About to make our third call the MagicMethod way and my sourcer is all ears.

Exactly what I want him to be.

It’s a fallacy to think phone sourcers talk a lot.

The simple truth is the good ones talk very little.

They listen.

They listen for the information in the silences because much of the time it’s in the silence where the information resides.

On our last call the young Gatekeeper either was a well-trained guardian or we did or said something that caused a warning flag to go up her flagpole.

I suspect the latter.

Remember, as I approached her I had a nervous would-be phone sourcer at my side, listening in with a special jack.

That played into my delivery and the fact of the matter is that when I glanced sideways and saw him sweating bullets it may have impacted my approach.

Phone sourcing is high impact and it can be high stress.

The key to phone sourcing is connecting with someone.

You have a very few seconds (maybe three) in which to do that.

If you don’t make that connection immediately it’s a pretty good bet your call is not going to be that fruitful.

As mine appeared not to be.

I shouldn’t really say that, though. Before she went south on me Lisa did tell me some very important information. She told me:

…her name
…the company had a casual atmosphere
…that Jim Walters was one of the pipeline engineers
…that he was one of six
…that they all sat together
…Jim’s three number extension

After she told me those six critical pieces of information, all of which I scribbled as she spoke, she transferred me to Jim. Knowing that the high likelihood was that I would hit Jim’s VoiceMail (even though she had just seen him arrive) I rode the transfer out to “listen” for more of what I could use.

That’s what I’m talking about when I talk about the information residing in the silences.

If you “listen” to everything that’s said each piece of information becomes a piece of the puzzle with which you can work to complete the whole.

I know some of you are wondering what would I have said if Jim had answered. Here’s the answer:

Nothing. I would have hung up.

The reason I would have hung up at this initial stage is that I am on a scouting mission and I don’t want to reveal more of myself than I must.

Jim is a valuable resource I may have to target later if I can’t decipher the message with the info I gather but to approach him at this early stage would be foolish.

I’ll repeat: At this early penetration stage a phone sourcer usually doesn’t have enough information to gamble a dice roll on an important member of the group.

Like a puzzle, we’re in the early framing stage.

That’s a good way to think of a phone sourcing project — you build the outer rims (frame) with the general information you gather (and extrapolate) and then you fill in the interior’s missing pieces.

Fortunately Jim’s VoiceMail answered his call and he hadn’t as yet changed his holiday message. (Employees often forget to do this and sourcing around the holidays can be especially revealing because of this!)  Jim’s VoiceMail told us what would probably turn out to be two other members of his group and their extensions.

Remember, Jim’s extension was 127. The extensions of the two others he gave me were 131 and 125. Their names were Michael Edwards and Sheila McKinney, respectively.

Now, we’re going to have a test.

The same test I presented my sourcer at this point when he excitedly asked me how do we get all of Jim’s coworkers.

You have the framework.

You tell me, in the comments section below, what you might reasonably divine from that information and why.

Be as specific as possible and give me the logic to your answer.

EXTRA CREDIT: Tell me why knowing Lisa’s name is listed as one of the six important pieces of information.
******

This is an ongoing series regarding phone sourcing. Here’s part I, part II, part III, and part IV.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip; it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE.
I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!
******

Much of phone sourcing is like taking a test.

If you hit a lot of headwind at one company skip to the next.

Don’t get hung up and don’t let it discourage you.

Remember, though, to write down exactly what occurred at the company you had trouble with.

This is so when you call back (either later in the day or on subsequent days) you’ll know what you experienced on your previous call(s).

Many times the early information you gathered will help you go further beyond what you were able to accomplish on your earlier call.

Also, information you learn from other companies might elicit ideas for you to use when penetrating the (other) more difficult companies.

Sometimes dilemmas answer themselves.

We’re about to embark on the actual calling that is an integral part of the training.

It’s 8:15 a.m and my MagicMethod student and I are all cozy sitting next to one another in his cubicle with his phone and his screen before us with his worksheet pulled up .

It’s an Excel doc. Remember, I had asked everyone, the day before, to set the following day’s work up in Word.

I work in Word because it’s easy to manage and I can easily navigate it when I’m on the phone; filling it with notes and information from each call.

I find Excel exceedingly jumpy and confusing and the last thing I need when I’m on the phone is to become flustered because I can’t handle the document in front of me.

Handling Gatekeepers is hard enough.

But, as I said at the end of last week’s lesson, that’s our challenge for today.

Remember, the day before in the day-long MagicMethod classroom portion of the training I had instructed each student to pick one of their open positions that was causing them heartache and choose a list of target companies we’d be likely to find potential candidates in.

I asked each student to set those target companies into a document along with their addresses, their phone numbers, faxes, website addresses, and bios on each.

I was facing very little of that on the Excel document in front of me, but as I had chosen the path less traveled we were about to forge on.

As he had already told me he was working without a job description, I asked him what the title was for the job we were about to embark on.

“Well, they’re called pipeline engineers but the trick is we have to find them for the Marcellus Shale reserves in the Appalachia area. I’ve looked on LinkedIn and there are a few but most of them are in Texas and Oklahoma.”

“What companies do you want to target?” I ask.

He then showed me the hodge-podge listing of the major players in the industry but it appeared that most of them had Texas or Oklahoma numbers.

I asked if he’d found any numbers in Pennsylvania, West Virginia, or New York because a quick Google glance was revealing to me that these were the states that held the Marcellus Shale.

“A couple – there,” he pointed.

What I was also learning in this first five minutes googling “Marcellus Shale” was that this is a pretty new industry — many companies were just beginning to build presence in the region.

This means that workforces are going to be relatively new and, in all probability, scarce.

“You say you found some pipeline engineers on LinkedIn?” I asked.

“Yeah, but most of them are in TX and few want to move to Appalachia. The winters are nasty and the culture is different and it’s very hard to get them to move.”

“That’s understandable,” I think to myself, remembering the summer trips we made as kids to Appalachia to visit my mother’s relatives. Much of the area is hard-scrabble and carries the reputation of being backward and remote.

It also has a distinct and rich background but that’s another discussion for a different day.

“What’s this paying?” I ask.

“About $150,000 for a guy with 5-plus years of experience. The problem is there are few in the area with five years of experience.”

“I can see that,” I nodded.

“They’ll take less experience,” he gulped out last.

“That’s good,” I thought to myself.

“They better,” I added, to him.

He seemed to relax, sitting back in his chair, as if the worst part was over.

He had no idea that we were just beginning.

“Okay, let’s get started,” I said as I picked up the phone and dialed one of the few numbers in one of the right area codes. I had quickly discerned that 412, 724, and 878 looked to hold the most promise for companies already in play in the area.

His phone had the ability to listen in on my conversation with a special jack and I had extracted a solemn swear from all of them that none of them would breathe an extraneous breath or issue a hapless cough while I had someone on the phone.

The number was answered by someone working in a trailer at a drilling site. The man who answered told me the only pipeline engineer he knew came out once every three months or so from Oklahoma and he could give me the Oklahoma main number. My heart sank but I forged on and asked him that person’s name. He readily gave it to me. I asked if he knew his phone number. He said it was there somewhere and could I wait a minute? I heard rustling like he was looking through papers.

“Here’s his card,” the guy said. “You want his cell or his office number?”

“Both,” I answered.

As he gave them to me I tried to enter them into one of the Excel boxes but messed that up so I quickly grabbed a pen and scribbled them down. I asked if there were any other companies he knew working in the region, and he rattled off a few. I scribbled those down as fast as I could too, thanked him, and hung up.

I turned to my sourcer and told him it would be worthwhile calling the one pipeline engineer we did gather on the call and that maybe because he was already visiting the area a few times a year he might be amenable to listening to a discussion involving a permanent move.

“Yeah, I could try,” he answered. I could tell he didn’t hold much hope in that suggestion.

“More importantly, he might know some pipeline engineers working and already living in the region,” I said.

I then instructed my sourcer to enter all the info I had written down into his document while I waited.

He obediently did just that.

When he finished I said, “Let’s call that one,” spying a 724 area code attached to a company that appeared to be one of the major shale companies already at work in the region.

A company VoiceMail answered that included an invitation to cruise their names directory. For now I ignored that sweet promise and pressed zero, hoping to talk to a live person.

A young chirpy girl named Lisa answered.

I identified myself and then asked her if they had a pipeline-engineering department at her location.

“We have pipeline engineers — six of them,” she offered.

“We don’t have a “pipeline engineering” department. We’re kind of casual around here. They do all sit together though,” she chirped. “Will that work?”

“It sure will,” I thought to myself while casually asking, “Are any of them in today?”

“I saw Jim come in a few minutes ago. You want to try him?” she offered.

“That would be great, Lisa. What’s Jim’s last name?” I prodded.

“Walters. Jim Walters,” she repeated.

I heard something.

“Does Jim have an extension or a direct dial?” I asked.

I glanced sideways at my sourcer. He looked frightened. I closed my eyes and focused on my target, refusing to allow his fear to creep into my delivery.

“127” she answered, not so chirpy this time but more a shade of caution in her voice.

I threw the dice. I could feel the window closing.

“In case I can’t reach him, who are the others I could try?”

“I’m not allowed to give out names here at the front desk. If you have a name I can transfer you,” she said, sounding just a tad bit embarrassed and suddenly towing the company line.

“That’s okay, Lisa. I understand,” I consoled. Can you transfer me to Jim?”

“I’d be glad to. Have a nice day!” she chirped again, suddenly brightening and then transferring me obligingly to Jim’s line. I was met with Jim’s VoiceMail, as I so often am. I waited to listen to his entire message. It was an old one that included a holiday greeting for the period of time he was going to be away, just past. It also included his cell phone number just in case I needed to reach him in an emergency and the names and numbers of two others who might be able to help me in his absence.

I scribbled it all furiously, listening intently.

When I hung up my companion let out a long sigh.

“Man, that was scary!” he almost shouted. “Woo-hoo!” and threw his baseball cap into the air.

Like I tell people over and over, phone sourcing is simple — but it’s not easy.

Few believe me.

“I couldn’t believe she told you they had six pipeline guys there! How do we get them?”

“That is the question, isn’t it?” I said.

Stay tuned and next week you’ll find out!

******

This is an ongoing series regarding phone sourcing. The beginning of this project is here.

Subsequent portions will appear weekly.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip; it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE

I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!

Most phone transfers end up in VoiceMails. This is a fact of American corporate life.

Here is an interesting recent LinkedIn discussion on the topic.

Always ride out the transfer and listen to the message on the other end. Many times it will hold extraneous information that will help you in your sourcing efforts!

He busily pulled up the Excel sheet that he normally works in.

In the day-long phone sourcing class I had given him and his cohorts the day before I had instructed them to prepare a call sheet (in Word) for our individual work together that included not only the job description of the job we’d be working together but also the companies they wanted to target for names as well as information on each company. That included listing those companies along with:

“…their addresses, websites, main numbers, their fax numbers, a brief bio on what the company does and any names they already have at the company.”

I looked at the Excel sheet and asked him where the job description was. He said he didn’t have one.

I asked him where the bio information was on each company. He scrolled right on the sheet until I saw a brief explanation of what the company did. It was 6-8 words, max.

I asked him where the names were that he already had at the company. He showed me a few scattered names,  most of which did not include titles or direct dial phone numbers.

I looked to see where the phone numbers for each company were. The ones I saw listed looked suspicious because most of them did not look like the “sweetheart” numbers many companies wiggle away from the phone company. They’re called “sweetheart” because, in an effort to be easy to remember, companies originally desired 00 numbers, as in their last four numbers including “00,” as in 4500, 2100, 6700, etc.

As I remember, the “00” was meant to bring up an image of a heart — therefore the “sweetheart” imagery.

Many of his numbers looked like direct-dial extensions far away from numbers that looked easy to recall.

Nor did I see addresses or fax numbers or the company websites.

I sighed.

This isn’t unusual: rarely do I encounter what I asked for in the first day of training.

Habits are hard to break — the Lord knows I know, but sometimes, when you’re being tasked to do what the teacher asks, for goodness sakes do it!

The first part of any sourcing assignment is to listen to the instructions.

The group had been given a 40-question “Phone Sourcing Quiz” at the end of the previous day’s training. It included the following question:

True or False? Most phone sourcers are Extroverts … they like to talk a lot!

This guy had given the right answer the day before: False. We had spent a good amount of time on the fact that one of the most important components of phone sourcing was listening, and he hadn’t listened to my instructions!

This is so common I can hardly describe my frustration. I’m not sure if it’s because they want to get started on the work that they skip the instructions or they really think ignoring the instructions is the answer and that their way is the better way.

If it’s the latter, there’s no sense in paying me thousands of dollars to come beat it in between their ears.

Apparently, that’s what some people need.

I prefer the tongue-lashing approach to a beating at the post.

Where are the fax numbers?

“I didn’t get them.”

The web addresses?

“I didn’t get them.”

The addresses?

“I didn’t get them.”

And why do we need them?

“Oh, yeah. For information in case we need it.”

And why might we need it?

“In case we can’t get in past the Gatekeeper.”

And why else?

“So we can call into the individual hinterland offices of the companies that some of their employees might be in?”

That too — why else?

He was catching on at this point.

“Because you told us to?” he asked, looking like a deer caught in a headlight.

“Because I told you to,” I repeated, letting my displeasure show.

I don’t think he’ll make that particular mistake again.

So there we were — and I had a decision to make. Do I spend one hour of the two I had allotted for his personal training setting up his job properly, or do I dive in, taking the chance that my expertise can flub through and past what information was missing.

I chose the flub through path, crooked as it was.

I’m going to stop here and talk a minute about listening.

If you do not listen (and this includes thoroughly reading) to the instructions on a job you may as well not even start it.

I say this because I want to impress upon you how important organization is when you’re phone sourcing.

There’s an Early American proverb that states:

“There’s many a Slip twixt the cup and the lip.”

What it’s always meant to me is that much can be lost between the time you pick up an object (or a project) and move it. If you don’t listen to the early instructions on a sourcing project (and this applies to you Internet sourcers too, en massed that you are) you’re going to miss key components that can help you achieve your goals.

In next week’s lesson we’re going to see what it’s like to navigate a poorly set-up job. In a later lesson we’re going to see what ease is brought to a properly set up one!

******

This is an on-going series regarding phone sourcing. The beginning of this project is here.

Subsequent portions will appear weekly.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip. It is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE.

I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!

Asking more than one question at a time (or giving out too much information) overwhelms most Gatekeepers.

After you’ve stated your name and repeated hers back to her (if she told you her name when she answered), give her one request only.

“Hi Sheila, this is Maureen Sharib. Can you please transfer me to your Quality department?”

That’s much better received than:

“Hi Sheila, this is Maureen Sharib. I’m working on a project and I need to speak with all your quality engineers. Can you tell me who they all are and then can you transfer me to one of them?” is just way too scary and way too many words for her to hear anything but what sounds like to be a “name raid” to her.

Trust me, she knows what a “name raid” is.

Easy does it.

I was there on the second day of the phone sourcing training I was doing for the company — the day where I visit each participant’s desk and sit with them, demonstrating and then listening in to them on the phone approaching gatekeepers.

Think of this as that day in school you sweated when the teacher handed out the “big test.”

You’re scarcely able to contain yourself for wanting to get the thing over with.

You fidget. You sit up straighter in your chair. You’re ready to begin.

And then it happens.

The page lands on your desk.

You wait anxiously for her to say “begin” as ‘she continues past you down your row.

You put pen to paper and you begin — at the beginning.

So it is with phone sourcing- there is a beginning point and an ending point.

The beginning point is with organization.

I ask each of my students on the first day of class to prepare a “call sheet” for our desk time together that includes:

• The job description
• The companies where they feel the people they’re seeking are most apt to reside
• A listing of those companies with their addresses, websites, main numbers, their fax numbers, a brief bio on what the company does, and any names they already have at the company.

I’m often asked why I need fax numbers.

It’s very simple. I need the fax numbers because sometimes when I call the Gatekeeper I meet with Unfriendly Fire.

Fax numbers save time.

I immediately glance at my work document for the fax number. If it appears to be the same area code and the same prefix as the main number there’s a chance the internal dials of the employees will also share those magical six numbers and it’s just a matter of calling in (I call this “stabbing in”) to numbers around and within the numbered range of the two.

Main: 513 891 xxxx

Fax: 513 891 xxxx

Sometimes the fax number will include a different prefix.

Main: 513 891

Fax: 513 793

In those cases the direct dials of the employees may share the fax number’s 513 793 beginnings and calling on either side of the fax number may land me on the desks of the employees. (They could, as well, land on either side of the main number as well.)

Sometimes none of this works but chance holds that one of the above two scenarios does work.

When neither works I have another trick. I go to Google and put in the company name and the area code. Many times this brings up the direct dials of employees from that company who have posted something on the Internet and left their signatures (that includes their direct dials) behind. In this instance it’s usually just a matter of picking up on that and running the extensions that align on either side out.

That’s my basic recipe for “stabbing in” when the front desk is no help. It’s rare that a phone sourcer who uses this technique to gather information does so ineffectively. Usually by the third or fourth live person who answers when you’re stabbing in willy-nilly, you have the information — or a good beginning on the information — which you seek.

I’ve digressed.

As it is with anything there is a beginning point. Our beginning point as phone sourcers is to have a carefully prepared “work document” that includes information that will assist us on the call.

We never know what’s going to assist.

The Gatekeeper might ask us what division we want the Controller of.

A quick glance at the company bio might reveal the different divisions so that you don’t skip a beat in answering her.

It also helps us use the lingo that is most likely to occur inside the company. Not all companies use the same identifiers for their divisions.

A company specializing in polymers might use the following words to separate functions within their environs:

Flexible

Rigid

Foam

Fibre

Elastomer

Coatings

Adhesives

By looking at a company’s bio (or even their main website page) you may glean what word it is the Gatekeeper is most likely to recognize.

You’ll sound more like you know what you’re talking about.

This, in turn will bolster your confidence.

This, in turn, will bolster your response rate.

Some companies use different job titles.

A Brand Manager in one company might be a Product Manager in another.

An Account Executive might be a Territory Manager in another or a Sales Rep in a third.

Still, a Quality Director could be called a Champion or a Master Black Belt or a lot of other things.

Taking a quick look at a company’s job page will reveal what they call themselves on the inside.

Knowing what language is used on the inside of a company is a true use of the words “semantic sourcing.”

I have to confess: I thrilled when I started to see the word “semantic” attached to “sourcing” in the Recruitosphere.

I thrilled because that’s exactly what phone sourcing is — linguistic semantics is the study of meaning that is used by humans to express themselves through language.

Voiced language; in this case — the stuff that makes many, if not most, sourcers nervous.

Talking to people — asking for information — pressing when you sense an opening — withdrawal when you feel a threat — retreating when you need to regroup — attacking when you know you can’t lose.

All this commotion that makes most sourcers uneasy.

Like our hapless recruiter sitting next to me. Next, we’re going to listen in on “the call.”

You’ll be surprised at what you learn.

***

This is an on-going series regarding phone sourcing. The beginning of this project is here.

Subsequent portions will appear weekly.

Here is this Tuesday’s Phone Sourcing Tip/it is also listed in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE.

I hope you’ll join and contribute to our discussion!

Identifying yourself immediately on the call goes a long way toward “removing the mystery” for the Gatekeeper. It is not necessary to state the company you’re calling from/on behalf or nor is it necessary to state the reason for your call. A simple acknowledgment of her name (if she tells you when she answers) and your name will many times get the job done!

“Hi Sheila, this is Maureen Sharib. Can you please transfer me to your marketing department?”

“Hi Sheila, this is Maureen Sharib. I’m trying to reach George O’Connor. Is he in?”

“Hi Sheila, this is Maureen Sharib. I’m trying to reach the Product Manager for your xyz product. Can you tell me who that is?”

If she does not tell you her name, just leave that part off. NEVER ask her for her name! This can be construed as confrontational and you want to avoid confrontation at all costs.

“Hi, this is Maureen Sharib. Can you please transfer me to your marketing department?”

“Hi, this is Maureen Sharib. I’m trying to reach George O’Connor. Is he in?”

“Hi, this is Maureen Sharib. I’m trying to reach the Product Manager for your xyz product. Can you tell me who that is?”

Phone sourcing is simple but it’s not easy!

“We’re doing that!” you hope think.

Are you?

Thorough sourcing is when you are confident you have everyone inside a specific company (or companies) that you can contact for your open opportunity.

It’s when you have a list of names along with their titles (and hopefully their direct dials!) that you can sit down and call through and pitch your position to.

Many of you are dealing with some very hard-to-fill positions.

Candidates are not answering your ads.

They’re ignoring your social media call-outs.

You’re not finding enough of them on the job boards and when you do find them on LinkedIn you can’t get in touch with many of them or they don’t answer your e-mails.

You’re not taking things far enough.

When you find a resume on Monster or CareerBuilder and the guy looks perfect, rest assured there are several others inside his past organizations who are also likely to look “perfect” if only you could take a look at them.

But you can’t because, alas, they’re not online.

At least they’re not online in a capacity that links them to your needs.

So what can you do?

If you’re resourceful and have the guts it takes to call somebody on the phone, you’re going to call into that person’s organization and nose around and find out who the rest of his team members are.

This is old-fashioned recruiting.

This is what they did back in the old days.

The technique is (still) golden and becoming more and more so as fewer and fewer recruiters do it.

When you do this, and you do it successfully you’ll be rewarded with knowing that you’ve done everything you can do to fill the open position that is causing you (and your boss) such heartache.

You’ll have done everything possible because deep down in your gut you’ll know that you’ve tapped every available resource humanly possible to fill your open jobs.

Once you’ve identified who the players are on the inside you can sit down at your desk and call each one of them up and present your side of things.

Until you’ve done this you haven’t done a thorough job.

Next week on ERE I’m going to start a step-by-step process of how to do the phone sourcing part of thorough sourcing.

In the meantime I’m starting a Tuesday Phone Sourcing Tip over in the ASK Maureen group here on ERE.

Here is this week’s “tip”:

When you’re calling into a company and using their directory to see “who’s still there,” don’t be convinced someone isn’t just because their name doesn’t show up in the spell-by-name function.

Most spell-by-name directories only list the persons attached to that particular office. So if you’re looking for someone in Spokane and calling Chicago headquarters, they’re not likely going to be listed in the Chicago directory.

You have to call the office the person is attached to in order to find them in the directory.

This is a common mistake novice phone sourcers make.

The BEST WAY to find someone in any particular company is to either:

1. Call the office the person is attached to, or
2. Call headquarters and ask the Gatekeeper to look in the global directory.

One of my telephone list builders works part time at the Y as a lifeguard. She’s a 50-year-old woman who has been married for 30 years. She and her husband have been living apart for the last couple years and it appears that each of them is creating their own separate life in preparation for what appears to be divorce.

I got to know Jean late last year in casual conversation as I bounced around in the pool doing my 45 minutes of pool work that I get to less and less these days. Talking to someone else in a pool while you’re doing jumping jacks is a good way to make the (boring) time pass.

Jean impressed me early on with her intelligence. She is soft-spoken and listens intently to what another is saying. I’d watched her interact with some of the other old farts as they came and went from the senior pool and many seemed to really enjoy talking with her. What I noticed most about her from my watery viewing point is she spoke far less than she listened to the others.

Some would stand there for a good number of minutes and yak away at her and she’d politely pay attention to whatever it was they were sharing.

I knew some of them were tiresome to listen to as I had seen the reaction of others to them in the social setting that the geriatric warm pool is.

I mostly stay to myself in the pool, social skinflint that I am.

But talking to Jean was different.

She asked questions.

Few people do this, you know.

Flattered as I was to be asked about myself, I very soon recognized the glimmer of a phone sourcer in Jean.

One day we got to talking about work. She said she was looking to do something to augment the lifeguard salary she was earning at the Y on a part-time basis as they had recently cut back her hours.

She was worried. She had her oldest daughter’s wedding coming up in July of 2011 and she had begun sharing with me knowledge of some very disturbing financial details of her husband’s behavior back on the East Coast.

She also had her second daughter in her second year of college at Purdue.

She needed to make money. Fast.

I asked her if she’d be interested in phone sourcing. She asked me what it was. I explained it to her best I could but I don’t think it was something she quite understood and I could see her hesitation.

Let’s not forget she hardly knew me.

I didn’t push it.

So I asked her if she’d like to do some phone work building call lists.

She asked me what that was. I explained that people pay us to build number-by-number direct call lists of employees inside specific companies in America — mostly with the intent to call these employees to sell them something (like financial services, etc.)

I could see she was interested but wary. She later confessed to me that at the time she wondered if I wasn’t running some sort of scam. She said she’d taken a leap of faith on me and did what I instructed her to do with the expectation of never being paid.

She was delighted when checks in the amounts of hundreds of dollars started to follow on a bi-monthly basis.

Soon she was developing and delivering 500- and 1,000-name lists of current employees of companies all across America with their direct dials and any information she’d gleaned from their voicemails that is always of interest to our customers.

She was digging the work because it was something she could do at night in those scary midnight hours when she’d lay awake worrying about what financial risk she was at with her long-distance marriage partner.

The work helped assuage her fears and her loneliness.

It brought in support dollars that had stopped flowing from her Atlantic coast spouse.

Today I asked her what she had learned in the near year that she’s been doing the work.

She was perched in her guard chair and I was bouncing up and down in the corner of the pool below her.

She came down off her chair and leaned close to me in the pool.

“You know, it’s funny you ask. I’ve been thinking about this lately.”

I nodded and she continued.

“Even though I have a bachelor’s degree from Purdue I never really thought about the bigger business picture of America. Those company blurbs you send me on the jobs that detail what the companies do I always find interesting. Many times they surprise me, as in ‘Oh, yeah, this company makes THAT?’ and I always find that fun.”

I nodded some more, encouraging her to continue. I could tell she wanted to.

“I realize now I should have paid more attention to languages. Many times the names are incomprehensible –”

“Phonetic spelling is fine,” I interrupted.

“But I’m very anal and I wish I could get the spellings closer to their correct spellings,” she countered.

“It’s okay — it’s the direct dial and the general name they’re most interested in. Providing that is the real value for these customers,” I consoled.

“I know — but still …” and her voice trailed off as she looked almost wistfully into the distance.

Looking back at me she continued, the pace of what she was saying accelerating.

“There’s something else I’m learning. Even though my husband is an accountant, he always had trouble working in the banking industry much beyond a couple years at each place. I had no idea that industries besides banking hired accountants.”

I nodded.

“When I’m working a phone directory I hear all kinds of accounting-focused messaging on peoples’ voicemails. There’s audit and reporting and all sorts of different areas related to accounting! That bastard always told me I was an unreasonable bitch to expect him to find steady work because there just wasn’t steady work in his profession in banking.”

“I realize now that it wasn’t me who was an unreasonable bitch all those years — the fact is he didn’t want steady work! If he had there are all kinds of things he could have done in all kinds of other industries besides banking!”

“I was basically a housewife for the first 20 years of our marriage raising our two daughters. I had no idea. I depended on him and I now realize what a mistake that was.”

I could see the flash of anger under the control and all I could do was nod again.

“But that’s okay. I’m making my own life now and it feels good to know that I wasn’t the cause of his failure all those years and my expectations weren’t unreasonable. I’ve learned a tremendous amount in the past year from the work I’m doing for you and I want to thank you for it. You have no idea what a difference it’s made in my life.”

“Do you mind if I write about this?” I asked. “Your lessons are valuable — I won’t use your name.”

“Of course! You can use my first name, but don’t use his. By the way, I’m thinking that maybe I might soon want to try my hand at phone sourcing.”

I laughed. Jean had no idea what a gift in the compliment of her growing confidence was (is) to me.

Why? Simply stated: Because people need to know they’ve been heard and understood. Today’s top sales performers know that it’s more important to understand than to persuade.

So what does this have to do with recruiting? Good question. Perhaps you can begin by answering these three questions yourself:

When you make a cold call, how do you start the conversation?

Mistake #1:

Like many recruiters, you might be tempted to begin the call by talking about a “great opportunity” … “with our award-winning company.” But ask yourself this. “So what?” How can you be sure that your “great opportunity” is a match for this prospect? Or even more important, how sure are you that this prospect is a good fit for your “award-winning company”?

Instead, begin the conversation by asking some good situation questions that help you better understand the other person. By asking questions about them up front, you are better positioned to develop rapport that can lead to great decisions for both you and the prospect.

When talking with a prospect (or candidate) about a job opening, how do you describe the position?

Mistake #2:

As a recruiter, armed with your company’s new marketing materials, you might be anxious to list all of the wonderful benefits your company offers (e.g., profit sharing, exceptional training, advancement opportunities, work-life balance). Of course there’s nothing wrong with being enthusiastic about your “product.”  After all, that’s a key trait of top sales performers. But remember, people buy products for what the products can do for them.

Be sure you know what’s important to the other person before you recite the list of company features/benefits. Then, when you are discussing a specific position, target the features and benefits that directly relate to the needs or interests of the prospect or candidate.

When a prospect gives you a quick “no thanks” (e.g., I’m happy where I am), do you know how to continue the conversation, or do you tend to get flustered and unsure of what to say?

Mistake #3:

If you’re like many recruiters, you might be tempted to continue with your list of company benefits — hoping perhaps that something might just resonate with the prospect. But that’s sort of like two people who speak different languages trying to have a conversation. When I’ve been in this situation myself, seems like I just start talking louder (saying the same thing over and over again in English, of course). Doesn’t work.

But let’s face it. No one likes objections. Did you know that objections can be viewed as simply a lack of information? An open invitation, if you will, to ask questions?

In the “no thanks, I’m happy where I am” example above, the best questions to ask are the ones that begin with “why, what, or how.”

Here’s a simple two-step formula that might help.

1. Step 1: Begin with a quick affirmative statement such as, “That’s great to hear.”
2. Step 2: Follow immediately with a why, what, or how question.
3. After your quick affirmation, say, “I’m curious to know –what do you find most rewarding about being at [your current company]?”

But asking good questions can be hard. We’re often programmed to “have the answers” and seem “in control.” “Telling” instead of “asking” is often just an ingrained habit. After all, “telling” does work. It can be quicker to simply “tell” and move the conversation along, rather than ask questions and potentially lose control.

A Little Experiment

Here’s an idea to help you become aware of your own habits. You’ll need two things for this experiment: a tape recorder and a person who is willing to act as your “victim.” Then choose a topic that your “victim” knows a lot more about than you do. Perhaps a hobby or specific professional area of expertise.

Record about 10 minutes of the conversation between the two of you, where your objective is to understand the topic.

Next, choose another topic where your objective is to persuade the other person of something of interest to you. Again, record the conversation.

Finally, replay and analyze each conversation. Note the number of times you are telling and the number of times you are asking questions in each situation.

Who talked more? Did you “tell” more than “ask” — even when your objective was to understand? When your objective was to persuade, who talked more? Did you “tell” more or “ask” more? How do the two conversations compare?

So as you ponder the New Year — along with a possible New Year’s Resolution — how about making a conscious effort to approach your conversations with prospects and candidates in a new way. Stop “talking nice about your company”… and start asking questions instead. And remember, “telling” isn’t “selling.”

The truthful answer to this is that if the Gatekeeper asks you this question, the high probability is that you didn’t approach her properly*. But, like everything there are exceptions. I’m going to go through a few of them with you.

The first thing that runs a red flag up a Gatekeeper’s pole is saying too much. Many sourcers, because they’re nervous, talk too much.

“Hi, Lorraine, this is Mike Schmidt. I’m working on a list for my boss and I need to know who all your Java engineers are.”

Do you see what you just did here? You offered information that you didn’t need to. It’s called too much information (TMI) and it applies heavily in phone sourcing. You just invited her to ask you more about your “list.”

“Hi, Lorraine, this is Mike Schmidt. I’m working on a list for TheServerSide Java Symposium 2011 coming up next March in Las Vegas, and I need to know who all your Java engineers are so I can invite them.”

What’s wrong here?

You’re not working on a list for TheServerSide Java Symposium 2011 coming up next March, and she can probably hear it in your voice that you’re lying. Chances are you’re sweating bullets through the phone and expert gatekeepers can feel your heat through the phone.

Most people can not tell lies effectively. You’re not likely to be one who can.

Think I’m kidding? Ask any professional Gatekeeper. Hell, ask just about anyone. Many people can tell when they’re being lied to.

“Hi, Lorraine, this is Mike Schmidt. I’m working on a list for my boss and we’re on deadline. In fact, if you don’t tell me who all your Java engineers are, my ass is grass and I’m going to lose my job and my five kids won’t eat next week!”

Guess what? A professional Gatekeeper doesn’t care about your kids, and using this cheap trick Drama Queen approach is full of just what it is — Phoney-Baloney.

These are just a few of the common mistakes phone sourcers make when approaching Gatekeepers. Can you think of and offer others?

*Approaching properly: Repeat her name (if she told you her name) and tell her yours.