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	<title>Comments on: Let&#8217;s Revolutionize the Standard Recruiting Model</title>
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		<title>By: New Site Aims at Creating a Common Job Language : ERE.net</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-7790</link>
		<dc:creator>New Site Aims at Creating a Common Job Language : ERE.net</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 17:54:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-7790</guid>
		<description>[...] Mark Bielecki is trying to clean it all up with a new site, Joblish. (And you thought startups had used up every possible fanciful variation of the word &#8220;job&#8221;!) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Mark Bielecki is trying to clean it all up with a new site, Joblish. (And you thought startups had used up every possible fanciful variation of the word &#8220;job&#8221;!) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Hal Amens</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3693</link>
		<dc:creator>Hal Amens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 06:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3693</guid>
		<description>As a current job seeker and sometimes hiring manager let me chime in about control. I put links to my Web site including examples of my writing on the bottom of my resume. A recruiter submitted  my resume and arranged a client telephone interview. During the interview I asked if the company had looked at my Web site which was included on the resume.

He laughed and said that all contact information including the Web site had been removed from the resume but he had looked me up on Linkedin, clicked on my resume and had checked me out before asking for the call.

Recruiter works hard to protect his source and the client does his homework on the Internet. I agree about who is in control. But both of us still need you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a current job seeker and sometimes hiring manager let me chime in about control. I put links to my Web site including examples of my writing on the bottom of my resume. A recruiter submitted  my resume and arranged a client telephone interview. During the interview I asked if the company had looked at my Web site which was included on the resume.</p>
<p>He laughed and said that all contact information including the Web site had been removed from the resume but he had looked me up on Linkedin, clicked on my resume and had checked me out before asking for the call.</p>
<p>Recruiter works hard to protect his source and the client does his homework on the Internet. I agree about who is in control. But both of us still need you.</p>
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		<title>By: Prince Paul</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3690</link>
		<dc:creator>Prince Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 02:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3690</guid>
		<description>Hi all,
I have been reading a whole lot of reviews on this topic that is truly close to my heart. I have my operations in India and pretty much think, its the same all over the world. Recruiters are extremely useful to &#039;speak&#039; the CV, describe the job&#039;market&#039; and when it comes to actual hiring its the e-sites. In fact I did an informal survey , which indicated to me that companies use consultants simply for two reasons , when they just cant get the right candidates or when they need their competitors information (benchmarking). Our survival thus is limited to either be a problem solver or a value adder never a simple direct service provider the activity so easily taken over by internal recruitment teams using the power of job boards / esites. Two option , as I see it. If the clients pays us for the solving problems, so be it , lets solve more of them. If the client needs more competitors inputs so be it we provide them with a better finise. The issue is how do we make them pay for it. Probably when the CEO needs more inputs he authorises the big five or the international consulting big names. When the HR needs it , they approach us,expecting nil payouts for their company. I guess , today every CEO worth his salt is probably more hassled managing his own staff than his clients ! Lets step in to help our client CEOs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi all,<br />
I have been reading a whole lot of reviews on this topic that is truly close to my heart. I have my operations in India and pretty much think, its the same all over the world. Recruiters are extremely useful to &#8217;speak&#8217; the CV, describe the job&#8217;market&#8217; and when it comes to actual hiring its the e-sites. In fact I did an informal survey , which indicated to me that companies use consultants simply for two reasons , when they just cant get the right candidates or when they need their competitors information (benchmarking). Our survival thus is limited to either be a problem solver or a value adder never a simple direct service provider the activity so easily taken over by internal recruitment teams using the power of job boards / esites. Two option , as I see it. If the clients pays us for the solving problems, so be it , lets solve more of them. If the client needs more competitors inputs so be it we provide them with a better finise. The issue is how do we make them pay for it. Probably when the CEO needs more inputs he authorises the big five or the international consulting big names. When the HR needs it , they approach us,expecting nil payouts for their company. I guess , today every CEO worth his salt is probably more hassled managing his own staff than his clients ! Lets step in to help our client CEOs.</p>
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		<title>By: T Tallis</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3686</link>
		<dc:creator>T Tallis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 08:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3686</guid>
		<description>Anthony: It&#039;s not that it&#039;s more work, it&#039;s a greater value.  Your clients have rightly or wrongly educated themselves that recruiting is a cost, like onboarding paperwork or advertisements. This is evidenced by the fact that they view the glass half full as an expense, not a yummy beverage.  They&#039;re paying a 1/3 fee for a 200k employee who will bring in 1mm in value in 12 months, typically.  

As contingency recruiters, we have a lot of flashy &#039;competition&#039; from usual suspects-- online tools purporting replace recruiters, fee cutters, etc.  The problem is, we have temporarily forgotten how to sell-- how to demonstrate the great value we provide-- and we&#039;ve taken the bait that we somehow *need* to change, adapt, become something different, evolve, or die as a species.

We HAVE to change.  You know, the more I hear this, the more I think it&#039;s untrue. Or at least it&#039;s chased me around the globe of logic so far that I&#039;ve come back to where I was when I was first accosted with this imperative.  

Crocodiles are still around after a million years. They are slow, and not good at jumping. Some recruiting trainers cum biologists should have written an article about how the crocodile needs to change.  

We need to change is more code language for &#039;buy my product, try my product&#039;, like the &#039;video professor&#039; on TV.  I only have to read FORDYCE where I&#039;m reminded episodically that there are consultants [that&#039;s &#039;first&#039; party recruiters for your Frank R., if you&#039;re reading this]  producing 1mm a year with barely more than a couple of researchers and a Rolodex.  Do we need to change our footing and balance? Yes. Do we need to buy into every pre-bubble-crash online tool and fad? No. Do we need to blame failure on the system? NO! Do we need to speak smartly, trust but verify, cover bases over and over again? Absolutely.

But let&#039;s get back to the revolution.  We should take the recruiting cowboys and tie them up in the barn, it&#039;s cheaper and less stressful. Everyone will be on staff.

Let&#039;s improve on that: let&#039;s just Walmartify the whole people supply chain officially.  We&#039;ll hire Dell&#039;s SC guy to run it, for the country while we&#039;re at it, let&#039;s nationalize it. We&#039;ll line up various employees not looking for work, make long lines of them on the trucking routes and train tracks, supply them with RFID chips, and feed the data into the system. When a client needs a new biological capital unit, or &#039;employee&#039; as we used to call them, we&#039;ll send the next replacement worker in from the supply chain! The paperwork will be prefilled.  Brilliant.

What? She doesn&#039;t want to go? She&#039;s not ready? But she has a tag! [She&#039;s in the system]. Not cooperating? Confused? Doubting the move?  Dog died?  House won&#039;t sell?  I don&#039;t get it. Unhappy with the service she received? Take a number. Press one for customer service to be transferred to the next staff person paid by the hour.

&#039;living for the big payoff, modify it so that the recruiter works on projects&#039;

I can see myself now, going to the party headquarters to buy my work overalls. The sign will read &#039;The people&#039;s HR supply store&#039;. I will be issued a standard hammer and sickle, work boots, and be paid by the hour....  I will not be burdened the the trials and tribulations of waiting for my big payoff...

-TT

Pam: I&#039;m getting to to enjoy your responses; I&#039;m starting to sense a distinct pattern of focus and self-determination.  Somewhere along the line, you must have lost your blurry vision and can&#039;t do attitude...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anthony: It&#8217;s not that it&#8217;s more work, it&#8217;s a greater value.  Your clients have rightly or wrongly educated themselves that recruiting is a cost, like onboarding paperwork or advertisements. This is evidenced by the fact that they view the glass half full as an expense, not a yummy beverage.  They&#8217;re paying a 1/3 fee for a 200k employee who will bring in 1mm in value in 12 months, typically.  </p>
<p>As contingency recruiters, we have a lot of flashy &#8216;competition&#8217; from usual suspects&#8211; online tools purporting replace recruiters, fee cutters, etc.  The problem is, we have temporarily forgotten how to sell&#8211; how to demonstrate the great value we provide&#8211; and we&#8217;ve taken the bait that we somehow *need* to change, adapt, become something different, evolve, or die as a species.</p>
<p>We HAVE to change.  You know, the more I hear this, the more I think it&#8217;s untrue. Or at least it&#8217;s chased me around the globe of logic so far that I&#8217;ve come back to where I was when I was first accosted with this imperative.  </p>
<p>Crocodiles are still around after a million years. They are slow, and not good at jumping. Some recruiting trainers cum biologists should have written an article about how the crocodile needs to change.  </p>
<p>We need to change is more code language for &#8216;buy my product, try my product&#8217;, like the &#8216;video professor&#8217; on TV.  I only have to read FORDYCE where I&#8217;m reminded episodically that there are consultants [that's 'first' party recruiters for your Frank R., if you're reading this]  producing 1mm a year with barely more than a couple of researchers and a Rolodex.  Do we need to change our footing and balance? Yes. Do we need to buy into every pre-bubble-crash online tool and fad? No. Do we need to blame failure on the system? NO! Do we need to speak smartly, trust but verify, cover bases over and over again? Absolutely.</p>
<p>But let&#8217;s get back to the revolution.  We should take the recruiting cowboys and tie them up in the barn, it&#8217;s cheaper and less stressful. Everyone will be on staff.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s improve on that: let&#8217;s just Walmartify the whole people supply chain officially.  We&#8217;ll hire Dell&#8217;s SC guy to run it, for the country while we&#8217;re at it, let&#8217;s nationalize it. We&#8217;ll line up various employees not looking for work, make long lines of them on the trucking routes and train tracks, supply them with RFID chips, and feed the data into the system. When a client needs a new biological capital unit, or &#8216;employee&#8217; as we used to call them, we&#8217;ll send the next replacement worker in from the supply chain! The paperwork will be prefilled.  Brilliant.</p>
<p>What? She doesn&#8217;t want to go? She&#8217;s not ready? But she has a tag! [She's in the system]. Not cooperating? Confused? Doubting the move?  Dog died?  House won&#8217;t sell?  I don&#8217;t get it. Unhappy with the service she received? Take a number. Press one for customer service to be transferred to the next staff person paid by the hour.</p>
<p>&#8216;living for the big payoff, modify it so that the recruiter works on projects&#8217;</p>
<p>I can see myself now, going to the party headquarters to buy my work overalls. The sign will read &#8216;The people&#8217;s HR supply store&#8217;. I will be issued a standard hammer and sickle, work boots, and be paid by the hour&#8230;.  I will not be burdened the the trials and tribulations of waiting for my big payoff&#8230;</p>
<p>-TT</p>
<p>Pam: I&#8217;m getting to to enjoy your responses; I&#8217;m starting to sense a distinct pattern of focus and self-determination.  Somewhere along the line, you must have lost your blurry vision and can&#8217;t do attitude&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Wager</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3685</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Wager</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 07:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3685</guid>
		<description>I have some matches here and would be delighted to cough up the price of a few gallons of gas.

These guys are like pacifists; &#039;if everyone just stopped fighting......&#039;

If they all went retainer you and I would eat their lunch by offering contingency, as you suggested.
The reason contingency has been around so long and is the dominant model is because IT WORKS.

Now, it doesn&#039;t work for everybody but neither does major league baseball, flying jets or brain surgery. Perhaps the answer is: if it won&#039;t work for you, try a nice job with a pension, perhaps your local DMV or Post Office is hiring.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have some matches here and would be delighted to cough up the price of a few gallons of gas.</p>
<p>These guys are like pacifists; &#8216;if everyone just stopped fighting&#8230;&#8230;&#8217;</p>
<p>If they all went retainer you and I would eat their lunch by offering contingency, as you suggested.<br />
The reason contingency has been around so long and is the dominant model is because IT WORKS.</p>
<p>Now, it doesn&#8217;t work for everybody but neither does major league baseball, flying jets or brain surgery. Perhaps the answer is: if it won&#8217;t work for you, try a nice job with a pension, perhaps your local DMV or Post Office is hiring.</p>
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		<title>By: Pam Claughton</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3670</link>
		<dc:creator>Pam Claughton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 12:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3670</guid>
		<description>Mark,

It sounds like the solution for you might be to make the switch from agency recruiting to the corporate side. The things you mention that you are seeing as a contingency recruiter are not what I am seeing at all, which makes me think you may be a bit jaded, or burned out, which is not an uncommon thing in our business. If you are looking to be paid more consistently, on a project or hourly basis, then contract recruiting may be a great option for you.

I disagree completely with the majority of your observations on the contingency world. I do recognize that there are many recruiters who do experience things the way that you describe, which is why there is so much turnover in this business. It is also why we are able to command the fees that we do. Our job is not easy. But, when we do it well, our experience is night and day different from what you describe. 

I completely manage and control the process all the way through. It starts by truly listening to both the client on what they need and the candidates on what is most important to them in their next role. If that is done up front, the rest of the process goes much more smoothly.

I do know what you mean though by sitting back and observing and crossing your fingers and hoping a placement happens...I&#039;ve seen recruiters do that in the agency I started out in. I&#039;ve never understood that as it&#039;s so easily avoided by simply asking good questions all the way through of both the candidate and the client.

When you do that, there are no surprises. You know  where the job ranks in the candidate&#039;s view of other positions, if it&#039;s the top choice, back up, etc and you know what they are pre-closed at. Where I&#039;ve seen deals fall apart is when these questions aren&#039;t asked, or are not asked each day...every time you talk with a candidate you need to ask them what has changed since you last spoke, because so many things can change...other offers, raises, etc.

 You also know what the company plans to offer, so that when the offer is given, it is smoothly accepted. That is what the company pays us for and the level of service that the candidate expects.

A good recruiter adds value, and deserves every penny of the fee that they earn. They also earn a different experience with the client, when they prove their value and become a trusted partner. This results in exclusive or preferred relationships, returned calls in a timely manner (often, access to the client&#039;s mobile for immediate reach), and trust that the candidates sent will be well worth interviewing, so they are generally scheduled with the hiring manager.

I think a key factor though is if you like the job. I&#039;ve been doing this for over 14 years, and I love it. I look forward to going to work in the morning, and think my job is fun! When it stops being fun, then I&#039;ll know that it&#039;s time to make a change.

Pam</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark,</p>
<p>It sounds like the solution for you might be to make the switch from agency recruiting to the corporate side. The things you mention that you are seeing as a contingency recruiter are not what I am seeing at all, which makes me think you may be a bit jaded, or burned out, which is not an uncommon thing in our business. If you are looking to be paid more consistently, on a project or hourly basis, then contract recruiting may be a great option for you.</p>
<p>I disagree completely with the majority of your observations on the contingency world. I do recognize that there are many recruiters who do experience things the way that you describe, which is why there is so much turnover in this business. It is also why we are able to command the fees that we do. Our job is not easy. But, when we do it well, our experience is night and day different from what you describe. </p>
<p>I completely manage and control the process all the way through. It starts by truly listening to both the client on what they need and the candidates on what is most important to them in their next role. If that is done up front, the rest of the process goes much more smoothly.</p>
<p>I do know what you mean though by sitting back and observing and crossing your fingers and hoping a placement happens&#8230;I&#8217;ve seen recruiters do that in the agency I started out in. I&#8217;ve never understood that as it&#8217;s so easily avoided by simply asking good questions all the way through of both the candidate and the client.</p>
<p>When you do that, there are no surprises. You know  where the job ranks in the candidate&#8217;s view of other positions, if it&#8217;s the top choice, back up, etc and you know what they are pre-closed at. Where I&#8217;ve seen deals fall apart is when these questions aren&#8217;t asked, or are not asked each day&#8230;every time you talk with a candidate you need to ask them what has changed since you last spoke, because so many things can change&#8230;other offers, raises, etc.</p>
<p> You also know what the company plans to offer, so that when the offer is given, it is smoothly accepted. That is what the company pays us for and the level of service that the candidate expects.</p>
<p>A good recruiter adds value, and deserves every penny of the fee that they earn. They also earn a different experience with the client, when they prove their value and become a trusted partner. This results in exclusive or preferred relationships, returned calls in a timely manner (often, access to the client&#8217;s mobile for immediate reach), and trust that the candidates sent will be well worth interviewing, so they are generally scheduled with the hiring manager.</p>
<p>I think a key factor though is if you like the job. I&#8217;ve been doing this for over 14 years, and I love it. I look forward to going to work in the morning, and think my job is fun! When it stops being fun, then I&#8217;ll know that it&#8217;s time to make a change.</p>
<p>Pam</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Deighton</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3681</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Deighton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 09:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3681</guid>
		<description>Mark,

Congratulations for taking the courage to express your opinions, even if some are unpopular.   I don&#039;t think you sound burnt out, rather you are questioning is the way you currently do business the best way to do it?  Nothing wrong with that.   In my opinion, the model has changed since the 70&#039;s, 80&#039;s, 90&#039;s and even in the past few years.  The advent of Recruiting Process Outsourcing, Vendor Managed processes, Talent Acquisition Process and retained searches have all evolved from the original recruiting model.   I believe you have to keep in mind that acquiring and retaining talent for a company is a business function that is as important or more important then anything else they will do.   The question CEO&#039;s ask themselves is should we do it or should we outsource it to an expert?   Some answer this by bringing experts inhouse, and the comment made from another person about being burnt out, you should become a corporate recruiter obviously doesn&#039;t understand the world of corporate recruiting today.   The pressures are as great or greater on the inside of the fence as the expectations to deliver doesn&#039;t diminish.  Those business leaders that choose not to bring recruiting internally rely on and budget for using external resources to attract the right talent.   You might want to make the pitch to an employer or two that you want to work exclusively with them for a set fee reviewed on an annualized basis, let&#039;s call it free agency recruiting.   If you ask enough company leaders about this concept you might just get a few to take you up on it.   I wish you well and thanks for the article.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark,</p>
<p>Congratulations for taking the courage to express your opinions, even if some are unpopular.   I don&#8217;t think you sound burnt out, rather you are questioning is the way you currently do business the best way to do it?  Nothing wrong with that.   In my opinion, the model has changed since the 70&#8217;s, 80&#8217;s, 90&#8217;s and even in the past few years.  The advent of Recruiting Process Outsourcing, Vendor Managed processes, Talent Acquisition Process and retained searches have all evolved from the original recruiting model.   I believe you have to keep in mind that acquiring and retaining talent for a company is a business function that is as important or more important then anything else they will do.   The question CEO&#8217;s ask themselves is should we do it or should we outsource it to an expert?   Some answer this by bringing experts inhouse, and the comment made from another person about being burnt out, you should become a corporate recruiter obviously doesn&#8217;t understand the world of corporate recruiting today.   The pressures are as great or greater on the inside of the fence as the expectations to deliver doesn&#8217;t diminish.  Those business leaders that choose not to bring recruiting internally rely on and budget for using external resources to attract the right talent.   You might want to make the pitch to an employer or two that you want to work exclusively with them for a set fee reviewed on an annualized basis, let&#8217;s call it free agency recruiting.   If you ask enough company leaders about this concept you might just get a few to take you up on it.   I wish you well and thanks for the article.</p>
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		<title>By: Landa Williams</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3680</link>
		<dc:creator>Landa Williams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 08:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3680</guid>
		<description>Mark, we&#039;ve talked about this for years in our firm. My business partner and our CFO has always said &#039;If we got paid for everything we do, our fees would be lower.&#039; Long ago, we switched to a heavily salary-weighted compensation plan for both our permanent and temporary recruiters. This meant less risk for our employees and a lot more client trust. 

Few in our industry could argue that recruiting for jobs at the lower end of the compensation spectrum takes less time or effort. Many industries acknowledge that smaller clients are more costly to service than large. 

Taking the process in-house does not solve the problem for our clients ... as third-party providers we are here to offer job-seekers and candidates choice and objectivity. An in-house recruiter will never have that advantage.

I would relish continuing this conversation with you and others of like minds. Landa Williams, President, LandaJob Advertising &amp; Marketing Talent</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, we&#8217;ve talked about this for years in our firm. My business partner and our CFO has always said &#8216;If we got paid for everything we do, our fees would be lower.&#8217; Long ago, we switched to a heavily salary-weighted compensation plan for both our permanent and temporary recruiters. This meant less risk for our employees and a lot more client trust. </p>
<p>Few in our industry could argue that recruiting for jobs at the lower end of the compensation spectrum takes less time or effort. Many industries acknowledge that smaller clients are more costly to service than large. </p>
<p>Taking the process in-house does not solve the problem for our clients &#8230; as third-party providers we are here to offer job-seekers and candidates choice and objectivity. An in-house recruiter will never have that advantage.</p>
<p>I would relish continuing this conversation with you and others of like minds. Landa Williams, President, LandaJob Advertising &#038; Marketing Talent</p>
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		<title>By: Anthony Meaney</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3678</link>
		<dc:creator>Anthony Meaney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 05:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3678</guid>
		<description>Mark:

I asked myself a lot of the same questions 10 years ago and ended up moving from contingency to retained search. 

However I think that clients as a whole are starting to question the billing model for third party recruitment on a more frequent basis. 

Example:  Why does it cost twice as much for a 200k search as a 100k search? Is there twice as much work involved?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark:</p>
<p>I asked myself a lot of the same questions 10 years ago and ended up moving from contingency to retained search. </p>
<p>However I think that clients as a whole are starting to question the billing model for third party recruitment on a more frequent basis. </p>
<p>Example:  Why does it cost twice as much for a 200k search as a 100k search? Is there twice as much work involved?</p>
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		<title>By: Keith Halperin</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3677</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith Halperin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 04:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3677</guid>
		<description>IMHO, much work that is currently handled by TPRs is due to client inefficiencies that could be alleviated by better planning. That being said, as a contract recruiter who came from the contingency world, I recognize that TPRs play a vital role in recruiting: finding and recruiting candidates that can not otherwise be obtained. For these types of candidates, TPRs are worth every penny they make.

Cheers,</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IMHO, much work that is currently handled by TPRs is due to client inefficiencies that could be alleviated by better planning. That being said, as a contract recruiter who came from the contingency world, I recognize that TPRs play a vital role in recruiting: finding and recruiting candidates that can not otherwise be obtained. For these types of candidates, TPRs are worth every penny they make.</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
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		<title>By: Paige Terracciano</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3676</link>
		<dc:creator>Paige Terracciano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 03:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3676</guid>
		<description>Mark,

I recently spoke to a VP that has partnered with a recruting firm to do just what you describe.  He pays them weekly for their services.  I find it to be a very interesting concept, and am considering offering such a model to my clients in addition to the contingency model.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark,</p>
<p>I recently spoke to a VP that has partnered with a recruting firm to do just what you describe.  He pays them weekly for their services.  I find it to be a very interesting concept, and am considering offering such a model to my clients in addition to the contingency model.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: David Stefan</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3675</link>
		<dc:creator>David Stefan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 03:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3675</guid>
		<description>Your not going to like this but regarding the article I think the contingency world has hurt the search business. Years ago it was almost all retainer. Then HR became popular. Then some people opened shops in their basements and found the only way to get biz was to work for free. HR in turn liked this concept thinking Hmmm I can cast a wider net, develope a huge data base to work off of then kiss both the contingency recruiter and retaned executive search firms goodbye. The search biz as a whole has lost some respect beacuse of the contingecy arrangement. Wouldn&#039;t it be nice if all or most recruiters banned together and went retainer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your not going to like this but regarding the article I think the contingency world has hurt the search business. Years ago it was almost all retainer. Then HR became popular. Then some people opened shops in their basements and found the only way to get biz was to work for free. HR in turn liked this concept thinking Hmmm I can cast a wider net, develope a huge data base to work off of then kiss both the contingency recruiter and retaned executive search firms goodbye. The search biz as a whole has lost some respect beacuse of the contingecy arrangement. Wouldn&#8217;t it be nice if all or most recruiters banned together and went retainer.</p>
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		<title>By: David Hafernik</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3674</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hafernik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 03:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3674</guid>
		<description>The fee structure and the complete and utter lack of control that the recruiter truly has are two of the main reasons that I am no longer on the agency/contingency side of the business.  

While the recruiter can try and influence both sides of the equation, I would never say that we have control.  The recruiter has virtually no control over the client.  We have no control over how long a client will take to interview our candidate.  We have no control over how long the client will take to give us any feedback on the candidate.  We have no control are the stability/funding of the position or whether the position is going to be put on hold a few weeks into the process.  We have no control over the client changing the requirements of the position half way through the search.  We have no control over the client on what an offer might end up being.  We have no control over how the client is going to treat the candidate during the interview or how well the client can sell the position to the candidate.  You can go on and on.

The recruiter also has no more control over the candidate.  We only know what the candidate tells us.  We can ask all of the right questions, we can prep the candidate to the best of our ability.  We can do background check and all of the due dilagence that we can.  But, if the candidate tells us that they are not talking to or interviewing with any other companies, we believe them.  We believe the candidate when they tell us what they are making and what it would take for them to accept another position.  We have no control over how the candidate acts during the interview (or weather they even show up to the interview).  We have on control over the candidate accepting an offer or deciding at the last minute to accept a counter offer and stay with their current company.  Once again, you can go on and on.  

For several years I worked as a contract recruiter.  I think that this was the best of both worlds.  The business was paying a set rate for my services.  If I continued to produce results, I got to continue the contract.  If I was unable to provide the flow of qualified candidates that they were looking for, they had the very easy option of letting me go and canceling the contract.  It was much cheaper for the client to pay my hourly rate than to pay a large placement fee for each hire that I facilitated.  One of the higher dollar searches that I worked on was for a Director of Compensation for North America for a major consulting company (think big 5).  They had already paid a retained search firm for the search but were not happy with the results (and were in the process of suing them to get their money back).  I came in and with the help of a name sourcer, was able to give them qualified candidates in only a few weeks.  They ended up hiring the top TWO candidates without spending any more money.  The entire search cost them just under $30,000 for two hires that both were paid salaries over $200,000.  Talk about a win-win.  They saved a tremendous amount of money and I made a lot of money at the same time!

Until enough contingency firms have the guts to change the fee structure, nothing is going to change.  Change will certainly not come from the clients.   The clients will continue to only want to pay for the hires and not the actual work that is being done.  

Imagine a fee structure that consists of a small fee for each qualified resume that is submitted.  An additional small fee for each interview that takes place and an additional small fee for each hire.  The client would actually have some skin in the game.  If they did not give you an appropriate job description up front, it would cost them money.  If they interviewed candidates and kept changing what they were looking for, it would cost them money.  If they keep interviewing and never made a hiring decision, it would cost them money.  All of a sudden, it is in their best interest be partner with the agency and make the hire happen as quickly as possible.  What a concept!

David</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The fee structure and the complete and utter lack of control that the recruiter truly has are two of the main reasons that I am no longer on the agency/contingency side of the business.  </p>
<p>While the recruiter can try and influence both sides of the equation, I would never say that we have control.  The recruiter has virtually no control over the client.  We have no control over how long a client will take to interview our candidate.  We have no control over how long the client will take to give us any feedback on the candidate.  We have no control are the stability/funding of the position or whether the position is going to be put on hold a few weeks into the process.  We have no control over the client changing the requirements of the position half way through the search.  We have no control over the client on what an offer might end up being.  We have no control over how the client is going to treat the candidate during the interview or how well the client can sell the position to the candidate.  You can go on and on.</p>
<p>The recruiter also has no more control over the candidate.  We only know what the candidate tells us.  We can ask all of the right questions, we can prep the candidate to the best of our ability.  We can do background check and all of the due dilagence that we can.  But, if the candidate tells us that they are not talking to or interviewing with any other companies, we believe them.  We believe the candidate when they tell us what they are making and what it would take for them to accept another position.  We have no control over how the candidate acts during the interview (or weather they even show up to the interview).  We have on control over the candidate accepting an offer or deciding at the last minute to accept a counter offer and stay with their current company.  Once again, you can go on and on.  </p>
<p>For several years I worked as a contract recruiter.  I think that this was the best of both worlds.  The business was paying a set rate for my services.  If I continued to produce results, I got to continue the contract.  If I was unable to provide the flow of qualified candidates that they were looking for, they had the very easy option of letting me go and canceling the contract.  It was much cheaper for the client to pay my hourly rate than to pay a large placement fee for each hire that I facilitated.  One of the higher dollar searches that I worked on was for a Director of Compensation for North America for a major consulting company (think big 5).  They had already paid a retained search firm for the search but were not happy with the results (and were in the process of suing them to get their money back).  I came in and with the help of a name sourcer, was able to give them qualified candidates in only a few weeks.  They ended up hiring the top TWO candidates without spending any more money.  The entire search cost them just under $30,000 for two hires that both were paid salaries over $200,000.  Talk about a win-win.  They saved a tremendous amount of money and I made a lot of money at the same time!</p>
<p>Until enough contingency firms have the guts to change the fee structure, nothing is going to change.  Change will certainly not come from the clients.   The clients will continue to only want to pay for the hires and not the actual work that is being done.  </p>
<p>Imagine a fee structure that consists of a small fee for each qualified resume that is submitted.  An additional small fee for each interview that takes place and an additional small fee for each hire.  The client would actually have some skin in the game.  If they did not give you an appropriate job description up front, it would cost them money.  If they interviewed candidates and kept changing what they were looking for, it would cost them money.  If they keep interviewing and never made a hiring decision, it would cost them money.  All of a sudden, it is in their best interest be partner with the agency and make the hire happen as quickly as possible.  What a concept!</p>
<p>David</p>
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		<title>By: Howard Adamsky</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3673</link>
		<dc:creator>Howard Adamsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 02:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3673</guid>
		<description>Although not ready to burn you at the stake just yet, I have gathered a small amount of kindling and am looking for matches.

I see some of your ideas as interesting but am not fully aware of how they would actually work. I think that there are many recruiters who like the idea of making a hit and getting a big fee for that hit. To be able to do something that others can?t do and get paid for that service is on some levels, a thrill. 

I get the feeling that many of your ideas/methods would have the client assuming a greater degree of risk; of having more skin in the game. Few clients are willing to do this for a host of reasons. (Mostly short term.)

If I were competing with this model, I would tell the client that they have nothing to lose working straight contingency because if they don?t get what they want, they don?t pay anything. Furthermore if they don?t see the new employee?s value as dwarfing the fee in 6 months, they should not hire that candidate in the first place.  

This bottom line ?opportunity? perceived by the client is of course a fool?s paradise but for the aggressive take no prisoners recruiter who sees company&#039;s, as either clients or sources, the model can work quite well. 

I think that one of the problems is that you are expecting corporate America to think. You have been in the biz for 35 years? How much great thinking have you seen and what is the result of that thinking s it relates to the agency/client relationship? Sad huh?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although not ready to burn you at the stake just yet, I have gathered a small amount of kindling and am looking for matches.</p>
<p>I see some of your ideas as interesting but am not fully aware of how they would actually work. I think that there are many recruiters who like the idea of making a hit and getting a big fee for that hit. To be able to do something that others can?t do and get paid for that service is on some levels, a thrill. </p>
<p>I get the feeling that many of your ideas/methods would have the client assuming a greater degree of risk; of having more skin in the game. Few clients are willing to do this for a host of reasons. (Mostly short term.)</p>
<p>If I were competing with this model, I would tell the client that they have nothing to lose working straight contingency because if they don?t get what they want, they don?t pay anything. Furthermore if they don?t see the new employee?s value as dwarfing the fee in 6 months, they should not hire that candidate in the first place.  </p>
<p>This bottom line ?opportunity? perceived by the client is of course a fool?s paradise but for the aggressive take no prisoners recruiter who sees company&#8217;s, as either clients or sources, the model can work quite well. </p>
<p>I think that one of the problems is that you are expecting corporate America to think. You have been in the biz for 35 years? How much great thinking have you seen and what is the result of that thinking s it relates to the agency/client relationship? Sad huh?</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Oldham</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3682</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Oldham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 02:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3682</guid>
		<description>Hi Mark,
I agree totally with what you propose and the reasoning behind it - as long as the recruiter cannot provide true value and deliver what is required by the client.
There is a disturbing and growing trend in New Zealand (which I assume would be the case in the USA too?) of employers moving away from recruitment companies to in-house solutions.  In house solutions are fine if you have the expertise.  In New Zealand, most companies do not -due mainly to the fact that 96% of businesses in New Zealand have 19 or less employees.  
With internet advertising being so cheap and easy, businesses have slipped backwards in recruitment sophistication.  The high fee structure charged by recruitment companies is too much to absorb and so they rely on this form of advertising  They end up with a bucket load of applicants and then use gut feel to choose.  When they get it wrong, the cost is much higher than the recruitment fees of course but it is too late then.
This is why we have set up a company called &#039;QJumpers&#039;.  
It does exactly what you say - charge for the services provided - not on a successful placement.  
QJumpers does as little or as much as the client requests and the costs reflect the workload.  
The target clients are not the same ones who are enjoying great service from recruitment companies.  There will always be a time and a place for this.  QJumpers targets clients who do not use recruitment agents.  The service model makes it a lot more affordable for small business to take a more scientific approach to recruiting.
But the catch - the selection responsibility lies squarely in the employer&#039;s hands.  QJumpers in know way pretends to know the business and team culture for every client that they service - this would be impossible considering the small company sizes, volume of small to medium sized businesses and geographic spread.  
Insead, businesses are provided with as much information about each candidate as possible to make their decision a more informed one - therefore reducing &#039;gut feel&#039; recruitment.
This service is taking off here in New Zealand.  Maybe there is a place for this type of thing in the USA?  Or is there already?
Cheers
Simon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mark,<br />
I agree totally with what you propose and the reasoning behind it &#8211; as long as the recruiter cannot provide true value and deliver what is required by the client.<br />
There is a disturbing and growing trend in New Zealand (which I assume would be the case in the USA too?) of employers moving away from recruitment companies to in-house solutions.  In house solutions are fine if you have the expertise.  In New Zealand, most companies do not -due mainly to the fact that 96% of businesses in New Zealand have 19 or less employees.<br />
With internet advertising being so cheap and easy, businesses have slipped backwards in recruitment sophistication.  The high fee structure charged by recruitment companies is too much to absorb and so they rely on this form of advertising  They end up with a bucket load of applicants and then use gut feel to choose.  When they get it wrong, the cost is much higher than the recruitment fees of course but it is too late then.<br />
This is why we have set up a company called &#8216;QJumpers&#8217;.<br />
It does exactly what you say &#8211; charge for the services provided &#8211; not on a successful placement.<br />
QJumpers does as little or as much as the client requests and the costs reflect the workload.<br />
The target clients are not the same ones who are enjoying great service from recruitment companies.  There will always be a time and a place for this.  QJumpers targets clients who do not use recruitment agents.  The service model makes it a lot more affordable for small business to take a more scientific approach to recruiting.<br />
But the catch &#8211; the selection responsibility lies squarely in the employer&#8217;s hands.  QJumpers in know way pretends to know the business and team culture for every client that they service &#8211; this would be impossible considering the small company sizes, volume of small to medium sized businesses and geographic spread.<br />
Insead, businesses are provided with as much information about each candidate as possible to make their decision a more informed one &#8211; therefore reducing &#8216;gut feel&#8217; recruitment.<br />
This service is taking off here in New Zealand.  Maybe there is a place for this type of thing in the USA?  Or is there already?<br />
Cheers<br />
Simon</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Wahl</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/comment-page-1/#comment-3671</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Wahl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 01:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2008/04/22/lets-revolutionize-the-standard-recruiting-model/#comment-3671</guid>
		<description>What you are basically describing is an end to most third party firms.  Just bring on a recruiter as a 1099, pay them an agreed upon price and let them go to work.  Good inexpensive strategy to minimize those 30% fees.  Thanks for the tip.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What you are basically describing is an end to most third party firms.  Just bring on a recruiter as a 1099, pay them an agreed upon price and let them go to work.  Good inexpensive strategy to minimize those 30% fees.  Thanks for the tip.</p>
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