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	<title>Comments on: Counterpoint: Why There is Absolutely No Difference Between Generations</title>
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		<title>By: James Confidential</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1936</link>
		<dc:creator>James Confidential</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Sep 2006 08:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1936</guid>
		<description>I see your point, and, as far as it goes, it&#039;s a good one, but surely you don&#039;t think that the decision calculus that drives the dinnertime choicemaking is the SAME as that which drives the choice I&#039;ll make when it comes time to decide where I&#039;ll work, or even how I&#039;ll view that decision in my internal &#039;rear view mirror&#039; do you?

Frankly, I wouldn&#039;t be caught dead at Chuckie Cheese, even for my nephew (which is why he learned to eat Lobster when he was four; only now am I beginning to appreciate what a horrible mistake I made. . .), but I don&#039;t view dining there quite the same way as I would an employment situation (frankly, if I did, I&#039;d never walk into a corporate cafeteria again, and I still do. . .hesitantly, yes, but willingly).

My point is that the &#039;generational schism&#039; is VASTLY overplayed, overanalysed, overcredited, and, frankly, overused.  As a profession, we have got to STOP looking for reasons that push people apart, and start looking for reasons that bring people together. . .either that or we need to change our definitions of terms like &#039;company,&#039; &#039;organization,&#039; and &#039;Human Resources,&#039; and begin to think of people, in the mode of the US Army (always a great source of inspiration) as &#039;Companies of One.&#039;

James.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see your point, and, as far as it goes, it&#8217;s a good one, but surely you don&#8217;t think that the decision calculus that drives the dinnertime choicemaking is the SAME as that which drives the choice I&#8217;ll make when it comes time to decide where I&#8217;ll work, or even how I&#8217;ll view that decision in my internal &#8216;rear view mirror&#8217; do you?</p>
<p>Frankly, I wouldn&#8217;t be caught dead at Chuckie Cheese, even for my nephew (which is why he learned to eat Lobster when he was four; only now am I beginning to appreciate what a horrible mistake I made. . .), but I don&#8217;t view dining there quite the same way as I would an employment situation (frankly, if I did, I&#8217;d never walk into a corporate cafeteria again, and I still do. . .hesitantly, yes, but willingly).</p>
<p>My point is that the &#8216;generational schism&#8217; is VASTLY overplayed, overanalysed, overcredited, and, frankly, overused.  As a profession, we have got to STOP looking for reasons that push people apart, and start looking for reasons that bring people together. . .either that or we need to change our definitions of terms like &#8216;company,&#8217; &#8216;organization,&#8217; and &#8216;Human Resources,&#8217; and begin to think of people, in the mode of the US Army (always a great source of inspiration) as &#8216;Companies of One.&#8217;</p>
<p>James.</p>
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		<title>By: Darryl Clements</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1933</link>
		<dc:creator>Darryl Clements</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Sep 2006 01:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1933</guid>
		<description>The article questioning the sanity of why so many business leaders and HR departments buy into stories about generational differences is
an excellent call to challenge convention.  I encounter the generation gap conversation when a business leader or HR leader is challenged
with finding and keeping high performers or in reaction to a misinterpretation of survey information.  To my amazement, I&#039;ve really
helped debunk this myth with leaders who don&#039;t just accept popular opinion and look at the raw data (usually readily available through
turnover and demographic information not even included in most surveys).  In the data you can almost always find that when new hires
or tenured employees within the same levels are compared to like employee they also tend to have similar career life cycles.  More
directly if a newly hired manager tends to have 5-year span in one position, that 5-year span usually isn&#039;t much different whether the manager is 50 or 25.  Whether 50 or 25, that new manager will be calculating her/his next step at the 4- to 5-year point, especially if the job or the person has reached the top end of where things can go.

The most important factor in the decision to stay or move to something else will be &#039;how does it fit with where I am in life.&#039;  Upsetting an
otherwise stable situation is something that anyone with more experience (often misread as age) is more deliberate about because that person has learned how stability at work impacts other parts of life.  To someone with less experience (often misread as age) and more
time to recover or regain stability, another move can simply be another move with more time to recover.  That&#039;s not generational gap -
that&#039;s a measure of risk versus reward.

The risk-reward equation is also where there are vast differences between actions due to specific factors other than age.  I agree with
your article statements but would supplement them with some simple one-liners.  When measuring long-term commitment to a company, expect tenured employees participating in a traditional pension plan to be more company-friendly and more likely to stay through events than newer hires partipating in portable 401k and cash balance plans.

If you could then agree that all other pay, rewards, and recognition were otherwise equal to all employees, then the generation gap argument becomes merely a collection of hypotheses.  Rather than going down to the individual intimacy level (and believe me I know it takes
some but not much time), leaders and managers want a one-size-fits all explanation of what&#039;s wrong.  Most don&#039;t know what makes each
individual tick, such as person&#039;s goals, likes, dislikes, where they are in their job-cycle, career-cycle, and life-cycle or other key
personal events.  By the way, most companies committed to succession planning do this only at the most senior levels so there&#039;s no surprise
that without it things fall apart at the levels where it&#039;s not done.

Other than start-up or turnaround situations, most employees really won&#039;t have the opportunity for a one-year megadeal and chance to win
the big one.  Employees have to look at the balance each day regardless of age to see if their job and company fits their needs.  Believe me, if there were generational gaps as the common thought would have us accept, internal employee surveys wouldn&#039;t reflect that 40-60% of employees are considering leaving.  It&#039;s usually not even mathematically possible to get to those percentages using generational age cuts alone.  It&#039;s takes a lot of people of all ages in all
generations to get to those percentages.

My bottomline solutions to ending the myth of generation gap: 1) Have HR do a historical analysis of voluntary resignations both before and after significant changes to retirement and compensation plans - wide view study will show that people have become more willing to move as
it&#039;s become enabled by employer pay and pension plans; and 2) Analyze retention data of like employees using age as a control factor -
making age a data control factor will isolate age and prevent it from being lost in the information spin.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The article questioning the sanity of why so many business leaders and HR departments buy into stories about generational differences is<br />
an excellent call to challenge convention.  I encounter the generation gap conversation when a business leader or HR leader is challenged<br />
with finding and keeping high performers or in reaction to a misinterpretation of survey information.  To my amazement, I&#8217;ve really<br />
helped debunk this myth with leaders who don&#8217;t just accept popular opinion and look at the raw data (usually readily available through<br />
turnover and demographic information not even included in most surveys).  In the data you can almost always find that when new hires<br />
or tenured employees within the same levels are compared to like employee they also tend to have similar career life cycles.  More<br />
directly if a newly hired manager tends to have 5-year span in one position, that 5-year span usually isn&#8217;t much different whether the manager is 50 or 25.  Whether 50 or 25, that new manager will be calculating her/his next step at the 4- to 5-year point, especially if the job or the person has reached the top end of where things can go.</p>
<p>The most important factor in the decision to stay or move to something else will be &#8216;how does it fit with where I am in life.&#8217;  Upsetting an<br />
otherwise stable situation is something that anyone with more experience (often misread as age) is more deliberate about because that person has learned how stability at work impacts other parts of life.  To someone with less experience (often misread as age) and more<br />
time to recover or regain stability, another move can simply be another move with more time to recover.  That&#8217;s not generational gap -<br />
that&#8217;s a measure of risk versus reward.</p>
<p>The risk-reward equation is also where there are vast differences between actions due to specific factors other than age.  I agree with<br />
your article statements but would supplement them with some simple one-liners.  When measuring long-term commitment to a company, expect tenured employees participating in a traditional pension plan to be more company-friendly and more likely to stay through events than newer hires partipating in portable 401k and cash balance plans.</p>
<p>If you could then agree that all other pay, rewards, and recognition were otherwise equal to all employees, then the generation gap argument becomes merely a collection of hypotheses.  Rather than going down to the individual intimacy level (and believe me I know it takes<br />
some but not much time), leaders and managers want a one-size-fits all explanation of what&#8217;s wrong.  Most don&#8217;t know what makes each<br />
individual tick, such as person&#8217;s goals, likes, dislikes, where they are in their job-cycle, career-cycle, and life-cycle or other key<br />
personal events.  By the way, most companies committed to succession planning do this only at the most senior levels so there&#8217;s no surprise<br />
that without it things fall apart at the levels where it&#8217;s not done.</p>
<p>Other than start-up or turnaround situations, most employees really won&#8217;t have the opportunity for a one-year megadeal and chance to win<br />
the big one.  Employees have to look at the balance each day regardless of age to see if their job and company fits their needs.  Believe me, if there were generational gaps as the common thought would have us accept, internal employee surveys wouldn&#8217;t reflect that 40-60% of employees are considering leaving.  It&#8217;s usually not even mathematically possible to get to those percentages using generational age cuts alone.  It&#8217;s takes a lot of people of all ages in all<br />
generations to get to those percentages.</p>
<p>My bottomline solutions to ending the myth of generation gap: 1) Have HR do a historical analysis of voluntary resignations both before and after significant changes to retirement and compensation plans &#8211; wide view study will show that people have become more willing to move as<br />
it&#8217;s become enabled by employer pay and pension plans; and 2) Analyze retention data of like employees using age as a control factor -<br />
making age a data control factor will isolate age and prevent it from being lost in the information spin.</p>
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		<title>By: Ernest Paskey</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1932</link>
		<dc:creator>Ernest Paskey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Sep 2006 07:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1932</guid>
		<description>Sure, the fundamental factors the individual and organization look for in each other may not vary much, but beyond that, I think generational differences are a huge factor in recruitment and retention. 

Think of it this way - everyone needs to eat and we all like to eat out once in awhile, but how many &#039;Traditonalists&#039; do you see eating at Chucky Cheese&#039;s? Unless they are with their great-grandkids, not many. And how many Milleninums do you see at &#039;Country Buffet?&#039; Both offer a place to sit and eat and have a conversation (ok, well maybe not at CC&#039;s).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure, the fundamental factors the individual and organization look for in each other may not vary much, but beyond that, I think generational differences are a huge factor in recruitment and retention. </p>
<p>Think of it this way &#8211; everyone needs to eat and we all like to eat out once in awhile, but how many &#8216;Traditonalists&#8217; do you see eating at Chucky Cheese&#8217;s? Unless they are with their great-grandkids, not many. And how many Milleninums do you see at &#8216;Country Buffet?&#8217; Both offer a place to sit and eat and have a conversation (ok, well maybe not at CC&#8217;s).</p>
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		<title>By: James Confidential</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1931</link>
		<dc:creator>James Confidential</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Sep 2006 06:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1931</guid>
		<description>I gotta agree with Lou and the others.  Yes, there are differences between people BECAUSE of their individual ages, but it doesn&#039;t necessarily follow that those age differences are always GENERATIONAL, and I think it&#039;s important to distinguish between these two absolutely different terms.  Differences in age and generational differences are not necessarily the SAME differences, even though they ARE differences.

I know it just KILLS us as HR-types not to be able to shove people into boxes based on large-group differences, but sometimes we just can&#039;t do it.  SOMEtimes, people are just different because they&#039;re different, and sometimes they&#039;re sort of the same because they&#039;re sort of the same, and you&#039;re just gonna have to deal with that, and an 18-year old and a 38-year old can be a whole heckuva lot more similar than a 21-year-old and a 24-year-old sometimes.  

So what do you do?  You get to know people as individuals, and treat them as individuals, and go from there. . .sucks, don&#039;t it?  But that&#039;s what you&#039;re going to have to do, if you want be known for treating people as actual people, and not just, you know, components in a box.

Warm Regards,



James.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I gotta agree with Lou and the others.  Yes, there are differences between people BECAUSE of their individual ages, but it doesn&#8217;t necessarily follow that those age differences are always GENERATIONAL, and I think it&#8217;s important to distinguish between these two absolutely different terms.  Differences in age and generational differences are not necessarily the SAME differences, even though they ARE differences.</p>
<p>I know it just KILLS us as HR-types not to be able to shove people into boxes based on large-group differences, but sometimes we just can&#8217;t do it.  SOMEtimes, people are just different because they&#8217;re different, and sometimes they&#8217;re sort of the same because they&#8217;re sort of the same, and you&#8217;re just gonna have to deal with that, and an 18-year old and a 38-year old can be a whole heckuva lot more similar than a 21-year-old and a 24-year-old sometimes.  </p>
<p>So what do you do?  You get to know people as individuals, and treat them as individuals, and go from there. . .sucks, don&#8217;t it?  But that&#8217;s what you&#8217;re going to have to do, if you want be known for treating people as actual people, and not just, you know, components in a box.</p>
<p>Warm Regards,</p>
<p>James.</p>
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		<title>By: Pamela Moore, SPHR</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1930</link>
		<dc:creator>Pamela Moore, SPHR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Sep 2006 11:37:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1930</guid>
		<description>There are certainly some valuable thoughts floating around about the differing viewpoints of our various age groups.  However, I believe that recruiting and retaining talent is a result of some basic practices that are not generation-related:

- Honest and accurate communication about position expectations

- Solid behavioral interviewing skills

- Common sense in managing employees: get to know your employees and their needs as individuals and do the right thing by them.

Peoples&#039; priorities will change as they move through life, regardless of what generation they belong to.  When they are younger, they may be more focused on money because they are building their independence, and when they get older they may have the luxury of focusing more on life outside of work.  All employees want to be respected and recognized for a job well done.  That is basic good management.  It shouldn&#039;t take generational studies to clue us in to that fact.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are certainly some valuable thoughts floating around about the differing viewpoints of our various age groups.  However, I believe that recruiting and retaining talent is a result of some basic practices that are not generation-related:</p>
<p>- Honest and accurate communication about position expectations</p>
<p>- Solid behavioral interviewing skills</p>
<p>- Common sense in managing employees: get to know your employees and their needs as individuals and do the right thing by them.</p>
<p>Peoples&#8217; priorities will change as they move through life, regardless of what generation they belong to.  When they are younger, they may be more focused on money because they are building their independence, and when they get older they may have the luxury of focusing more on life outside of work.  All employees want to be respected and recognized for a job well done.  That is basic good management.  It shouldn&#8217;t take generational studies to clue us in to that fact.</p>
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		<title>By: Kara Yarnot</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1929</link>
		<dc:creator>Kara Yarnot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Sep 2006 05:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1929</guid>
		<description>I agree that most workers, regardless of generation, have similar career needs and goals and that environmental factors have impacted their ability and willingness to make career adjustments to achieve these goals.

I believe, however, that much of the &#039;generational differences&#039; literature also focuses on making the employment experience a positive one.  In this area, I think it is important to understand generational differences.  Managers of recent college grads need to be aware of their comfort with technology, their preferred means of communication, their preference for working in teams, etc.  While these same recent grads need to be aware that their Gen X managers tend to be more comfortable in independent roles and their Baby Boomer Directors and VPs may not be as comfortable with technology.

So, let&#039;s not throw out all of the research and literature on generations.  Understanding differences in workplace styles is still important to retention, productivity and performance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that most workers, regardless of generation, have similar career needs and goals and that environmental factors have impacted their ability and willingness to make career adjustments to achieve these goals.</p>
<p>I believe, however, that much of the &#8216;generational differences&#8217; literature also focuses on making the employment experience a positive one.  In this area, I think it is important to understand generational differences.  Managers of recent college grads need to be aware of their comfort with technology, their preferred means of communication, their preference for working in teams, etc.  While these same recent grads need to be aware that their Gen X managers tend to be more comfortable in independent roles and their Baby Boomer Directors and VPs may not be as comfortable with technology.</p>
<p>So, let&#8217;s not throw out all of the research and literature on generations.  Understanding differences in workplace styles is still important to retention, productivity and performance.</p>
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		<title>By: Irene Sinteff</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1928</link>
		<dc:creator>Irene Sinteff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Sep 2006 04:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1928</guid>
		<description>Perhaps it is not the job seekers from different generations who have different hopes for their jobs and careers, but rather the recruiters who make the assumptions and have the biases that feed the media hype?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps it is not the job seekers from different generations who have different hopes for their jobs and careers, but rather the recruiters who make the assumptions and have the biases that feed the media hype?</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Gately</title>
		<link>http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/comment-page-1/#comment-1927</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Gately</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Sep 2006 03:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ere.net/2006/09/07/counterpoint-why-there-is-absolutely-no-difference-between-generations/#comment-1927</guid>
		<description>Thanks Lou for another insightful article.

Perhaps some managers want rules for managing different generations so they can avoid doing the hard work of managing, i.e., talking with each direct report one-on-one to get to know them. If employers selected their managers based on the managers&#039; degree of job match, i.e., they have the talent for the job, employers would have more effective managers no matter how old the direct reports. 

Employers should hire for talent or as Lou wrote &#039;hire only people who have excelled at doing the real work you want done. This process is called job matching.&#039; Job matching works.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Lou for another insightful article.</p>
<p>Perhaps some managers want rules for managing different generations so they can avoid doing the hard work of managing, i.e., talking with each direct report one-on-one to get to know them. If employers selected their managers based on the managers&#8217; degree of job match, i.e., they have the talent for the job, employers would have more effective managers no matter how old the direct reports. </p>
<p>Employers should hire for talent or as Lou wrote &#8216;hire only people who have excelled at doing the real work you want done. This process is called job matching.&#8217; Job matching works.</p>
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